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Vertical power support

marnsci

marnsci

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Dear community,

I am becoming very worried I made a bad choice in going with a vertical power system. I have reached out to them over the phone and through email looking for technical support for well over 3 weeks. I can’t seem to get them to return an email or answer a phone call, are they going out of business? Either way, I can’t move forward without their support, any help from you all as to how to get them to respond or if I should just cut my losses and write them off as worthless.

I am at the electronics install portion of an RV8 build installing IFR Garmin System, looking for information from them on using the VPX system for flaps and trim or the garmin gad 27.

Very frustrated a company I have spent money with is not supporting their product.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Don
 
Huh! I called just the other day and their tech rep called me back within a few minutes. He was right on point and had me fixed in just a couple of minutes.

I have the Dynon Skyview system. I went with the Auto-trim feature on the Dynon AP control panel. But, I used flap control through VP-X and flap position through the Skyview EMS. It seemed straight forward to me.

Is there an EAA chapter near you? Perhaps you can make contact with a EAA tech counselor.
 
N804RV said:
Huh! I called just the other day and their tech rep called me back within a few minutes. He was right on point and had me fixed in just a couple of minutes.

I have the Dynon Skyview system. I went with the Auto-trim feature on the Dynon AP control panel. But, I used flap control through VP-X and flap position through the Skyview EMS. It seemed straight forward to me.

Is there an EAA chapter near you? Perhaps you can make contact with a EAA tech counselor.
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Wow, wish I had that kind of service, have left 3 voice messages and 2 emails, nothing.

I am here in So. Cal and belong to ch 92, good call, In will reach out to them and see if they can help.
 
The VPX will do the flaps and the trim functions. You do not need a GAD27. Look at the J1pinout pins 3-18. its all in the VPX IM.IMG_2030.jpeg
 
stigaro said:
What’s your question? There is lots of experience with VPX’s on this forum.
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Thanks Mike, I understand that the vpx handles flaps and trim. What I am trying to figure out is what the is difference between vpx the Gad27. Garmin obviously wants you to buy all their components therefore the 27. I just want to make sure there are no downsides to using the vpx over the 27.

Thanks for the help.
 
marnsci said:
Thanks Mike, I understand that the vpx handles flaps and trim. What I am trying to figure out is what the is difference between vpx the Gad27. Garmin obviously wants you to buy all their components therefore the 27. I just want to make sure there are no downsides to using the vpx over the 27.

Thanks for the help.
Click to expand...
I have the vpx in my -10. I use it for trim and flaps and it works fine.

A couple things to know, though. If you are going to use speed trim, the vpx reduces the voltage to reduce the trim motor speed, which results in less force available for the trim motor to move the tab. This has been an issue in my -10, as trim speed (power) less than about 80% results in the trim motor being unable to move the tab. I am still troubleshooting, so it very well may be a RAC servo problem. I am not sure if the GAD27 uses PWM for the speed function but if it does, it would be better. Also, the UI for the VPX is pretty dated, think windows 3.1.
 
I've forgotten a lot of what I once knew and I'm still learning to use the system, but I chose to use the GAD-27 with the VP-X. In my installation, I'm using the VP-X only for the electronic circuit breakers. Everything else is run through the GAD-27 (flap control, trim control, interior and exterior lighting control).

The reason I chose this was to keep as many functions native to the Garmin architecture as possible. Again, I've forgotten a lot of the specifics that influenced my decision researching this choice and I know some aspects have been mitigated by the continued G3X enhancements made available through OS updates, but so far everything is working fine.

Also, using the GAD-27 gives you the opportunity to wire additional discrete inputs, if that's a consideration.
 
I installed a VPX in my latest project and had to contact their support a couple times, I generally got a callback within 24 hours if they didn't answer the phone.

I'm not suggesting this is a good business practice but if your call to support was asking them to compare their product to another competing product and they didn't call you back that may be the reason, not really a request for support for their product.
 
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marnsci said:
Thanks Mike, I understand that the vpx handles flaps and trim. What I am trying to figure out is what the is difference between vpx the Gad27. Garmin obviously wants you to buy all their components therefore the 27. I just want to make sure there are no downsides to using the vpx over the 27.

Thanks for the help.
Click to expand...
PM me and I will share with you the load planner that I use for my RV8. Found no need for the GAD 27 since it just duplicates what the VPX does without the advantage of the electronic circuit breakers.
 
I'm installing a VPX Pro now, but am weighing the option of adding the GAD 27 as well. I am not flying yet, so cannot comment on the day-to-day use. While the VPX has flap and trim control, the flaps apparently deploy in steps, but retract all the way in one step while the GAD 27 will retract in steps. The trim speed has already been mentioned above, so I won't repeat that advantage of the GAD for that. The GAD 27 also integrates all lighting control with both analog and PWM outputs. However, the VPX adds up to 32 electronically controlled circuits and 10 active-low switches. In my mind, this greatly simplifies the wiring and eliminates the need for additional relay circuits for high current devices.

If I had to choose just one, I'd choose the VPX. But is the GAD worth adding once you have the VPX? I honestly don't know.
 
With the GAD 27 you get better options to configure the Advance Guage Configuration (Although a recent software update by Garmin has made doing this with VPX slightly easier). I have 2 airframes with VPX and if I was going to do it again, I would use the VPX for circuit breakers and a GAD 27 for everything else. It's very nice to see exactly your amp draw circuit by circuit for troubleshooting and load reduction if needed. You also get start circuit disabled if RPM is over XXX value.
 
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stigaro said:
I'm installing a VPX Pro now, but am weighing the option of adding the GAD 27 as well. I am not flying yet, so cannot comment on the day-to-day use. While the VPX has flap and trim control, the flaps apparently deploy in steps, but retract all the way in one step while the GAD 27 will retract in steps. The trim speed has already been mentioned above, so I won't repeat that advantage of the GAD for that. The GAD 27 also integrates all lighting control with both analog and PWM outputs. However, the VPX adds up to 32 electronically controlled circuits and 10 active-low switches. In my mind, this greatly simplifies the wiring and eliminates the need for additional relay circuits for high current devices.

If I had to choose just one, I'd choose the VPX. But is the GAD worth adding once you have the VPX? I honestly don't know.
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The vpx flap extend/retract is programmable in several different ways.

As I said, the trim speed may or may not be a vpx issue in my case. It could be the RAC servo…

When I build next, I will likely use the Vpx AND the GAD27.
 
rocketman1988 said:
The vpx flap extend/retract is programmable in several different ways.

As I said, the trim speed may or may not be a vpx issue in my case. It could be the RAC servo…

When I build next, I will likely use the Vpx AND the GAD27.
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All the panels I’ve installed I’ve used the GAD27 once and no VPX, I see no need for either one honestly.
Spend the money you saved on a GTN750Xi instead.
 
We have the VPX installed, and it is configured to run the flaps, and it provides power (but not speed control) for the trim. The biggest difference that I've seen is that the GAD27 flap retraction behavior. They both support intermediate position based extension of the flaps (i.e Flaps-0, Flaps-15, Flaps-30). The VPX considers any "up" flap command to be a retraction the way to 0 degrees. The GAD27 allows a tap to partially retract from Flaps-30 to Flaps-15. Important? You decide.
 
georgemohr said:
The VPX considers any "up" flap command to be a retraction the way to 0 degrees. The GAD27 allows a tap to partially retract from Flaps-30 to Flaps-15. Important? You decide.
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There is a work-around for this behavior (which I use) is to set the reflex position to -10 degrees of flaps (Or pick a number for your first down flap position) Then set your next 2 flap positions. When flaps are down all the way, and I give it one push up they retract to flaps 1 and stop. Flaps 1 is not speed limited, but you do get a CAS alarm if over your flap limit airspeed. Your 6,7,8 and 9 don't know you do not have a have "reflex" position which in my 14 is a waste of a push as it makes zero difference to the performance of the airframe or at least to date (600+ hrs. and lots of cross country) haven't found one.

BTW most of the time when I call, I can get a live person but to date they have never not called me back within a reasonable time, as of a month ago.
 
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I remember thinking through this with my 10. Ended up just doing the VPX and not the GAD 27. I like all the features of the VPX and can’t think of anything the GAD would have offered that I’m missing.

For the trim issue stated above I just upped the motor percentage so I could trim at high speeds.
 
I'm not sure how the Dynon system works, but the Garmin system will run the speed sensitive trim through the AP servos (thus also enabling auto trim). I can see no reason at all to use the VPX speed sensitive trim features in such an installation.
 
rocketman1988 said:
Please explain.
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Vertical have never released any design or test data on their system, hardware, software or system. We don't know what kind of standards are used in design, manufacturing or testing. Why don't they release any data? If they used typical aviation standards, even for guidance, wouldn't they say so?
Garmin are more open that they use common aerospace standards in their programmes, even though their equipment for the experimental market is not qualified to a TSO or similar.
The conclusion I come to is that the Garmin equipment is likely to be of higher integrity - that is do what it claims to do more reliably - than a Vertical product. I'm not saying a Vertical product is unreliable.
Therefore, when thinking about flight critical functions - control of flaps and/or trim - I would use the product with highest integrity, the GAD. At least we can be reasonably sure the airspeed information on the Garmin CAN bus is likely to be accurate, and its use in determining trim/flap speed/position is tested. How do we know what happens to the airspeed interface to a VPX and what testing has been done to ensure nothing daft happens if the interface fails.
Neither device is on my aeroplane as I do not see the need for either (G3X Touch system with electric trim and flaps), nor do I use autotrim and have never wanted for it.
 
penguin said:
Vertical have never released any design or test data on their system, hardware, software or system. We don't know what kind of standards are used in design, manufacturing or testing. Why don't they release any data? If they used typical aviation standards, even for guidance, wouldn't they say so?
Garmin are more open that they use common aerospace standards in their programmes, even though their equipment for the experimental market is not qualified to a TSO or similar.
The conclusion I come to is that the Garmin equipment is likely to be of higher integrity - that is do what it claims to do more reliably - than a Vertical product. I'm not saying a Vertical product is unreliable.
Therefore, when thinking about flight critical functions - control of flaps and/or trim - I would use the product with highest integrity, the GAD. At least we can be reasonably sure the airspeed information on the Garmin CAN bus is likely to be accurate, and its use in determining trim/flap speed/position is tested. How do we know what happens to the airspeed interface to a VPX and what testing has been done to ensure nothing daft happens if the interface fails.
Neither device is on my aeroplane as I do not see the need for either (G3X Touch system with electric trim and flaps), nor do I use autotrim and have never wanted for it.
Click to expand...

So no proof one is more reliable than the other, just a hunch?

I’ve had a GAD27, a Garmin Servo, and a GMU22 fail or had an issue out of the box. None of this stuff is bullet proof.
 
georgemohr said:
We have the VPX installed, and it is configured to run the flaps, and it provides power (but not speed control) for the trim. The biggest difference that I've seen is that the GAD27 flap retraction behavior. They both support intermediate position based extension of the flaps (i.e Flaps-0, Flaps-15, Flaps-30). The VPX considers any "up" flap command to be a retraction the way to 0 degrees. The GAD27 allows a tap to partially retract from Flaps-30 to Flaps-15. Important? You decide.
Click to expand...

bkervaski said:
So no proof one is more reliable than the other, just a hunch?

I’ve had a GAD27, a Garmin Servo, and a GMU22 fail or had an issue out of the box. None of this stuff is bullet proof.
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Exactly.
 
This is why I like this forum, great info, great use of data to support (mostly), all from actual experience, which is very helpful. Thanks for all the insights.
 
bkervaski said:
So no proof one is more reliable than the other, just a hunch?

I’ve had a GAD27, a Garmin Servo, and a GMU22 fail or had an issue out of the box. None of this stuff is bullet proof.
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Correct, nothing fitted to our aircraft is completely reliable, including the engine and the pilot.
But if it is not installed it can't break, doesn't weigh anything or cost anything or take time to fit, that's why I don't have a either.
Neither product offered anything I can't live without or get some other way.
Is really difficult to find any hard data on the design of pretty much all uncertified avionics available so hunches is all we have to go on.
My hunch, based on 30 years of designing and certifying avionic systems, is Garmin equipment is likely to have greater integrity than Vertical Power equipment, I can't put numbers to that as there is almost no data available. Your hunch may be different.
 
penguin said:
Correct, nothing fitted to our aircraft is completely reliable, including the engine and the pilot.
But if it is not installed it can't break, doesn't weigh anything or cost anything or take time to fit, that's why I don't have a either.
Neither product offered anything I can't live without or get some other way.
Is really difficult to find any hard data on the design of pretty much all uncertified avionics available so hunches is all we have to go on.
My hunch, based on 30 years of designing and certifying avionic systems, is Garmin equipment is likely to have greater integrity than Vertical Power equipment, I can't put numbers to that as there is almost no data available. Your hunch may be different.
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The problem with your original statement claiming “Garmin has higher integrity” is this very fact that your stance on this is indeed just your personal “hunch” based on ??? (Assuming you are relying on your years of experience with Vertical Power and Garmin. Although it sounds like you have no first hand experience with Vertical Power, based upon your statements.). Yet, you state all of this as if it is a known fact that has concrete verifiable data supporting your stance. That is the real issue being raised. There is nothing about posting on an internet forum that stops anyone from posting such “opinions”. However, when someone posts their opinion as if it were a “factual” conclusion that should be taken as expert guidance, there are going to be questions raised.
 
My experience with Dynon so far has been very positive. Their gear, that I have installed just works. On the other hand, Garmin G-5/GFC 500 combos installed on several certified aircraft I had the 'pleasure' of both flying and troubleshooting (when the owner called me after paying a shop to install and then fix when it didn't work), has been an ongoing PITA. My hunch is that it is mostly shop related. But still, this is a shop that Garmin deemed fit to support (they have the "Garmin" piece of paper hanging on their wall).
 
rocketman1988 said:
The vpx flap extend/retract is programmable in several different ways.

As I said, the trim speed may or may not be a vpx issue in my case. It could be the RAC servo…

When I build next, I will likely use the Vpx AND the GAD27.
Click to expand...
Doesn't the GSA28 perform speed trim using PWM? The VPX manual suggests disabling the VPX speed trim and using the GSA28 for this.
 
RVbySDI said:
The problem with your original statement claiming “Garmin has higher integrity” is this very fact that your stance on this is indeed just your personal “hunch” based on ??? (Assuming you are relying on your years of experience with Vertical Power and Garmin. Although it sounds like you have no first hand experience with Vertical Power, based upon your statements.). Yet, you state all of this as if it is a known fact that has concrete verifiable data supporting your stance. That is the real issue being raised. There is nothing about posting on an internet forum that stops anyone from posting such “opinions”. However, when someone posts their opinion as if it were a “factual” conclusion that should be taken as expert guidance, there are going to be questions raised.
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I have no problem standing by that statement.
Nothing in experimental avionics is concrete or verifiable.
At least Garmin take some steps to show there is some substance behind their corporate processes.
Vertical Power have always (for the last 20 years or so) point blank refused to provide any detail on their processes.
If their processes use industry standards (DO-160, DO-178, etc) as guidance I can't see why they wouldn't say so.
 
penguin said:
But if it is not installed it can't break, doesn't weigh anything or cost anything or take time to fit, that's why I don't have a either.
Click to expand...

Me too, despite the effort required to thumb a switch.

The Tech Toy Junkie

(1) Claims you can't know how good it is until you try it.

(2) Choice to use is mostly supported by other users.

(3) Believes it enhances ability to function.

(4) Once installed, can't function without it.

(5) Dealer says everything is fine.

(6) Treatment time can remove user from circulation.
 
N804RV said:
My experience with Dynon so far has been very positive. Their gear, that I have installed just works. On the other hand, Garmin G-5/GFC 500 combos installed on several certified aircraft I had the 'pleasure' of both flying and troubleshooting (when the owner called me after paying a shop to install and then fix when it didn't work), has been an ongoing PITA. My hunch is that it is mostly shop related. But still, this is a shop that Garmin deemed fit to support (they have the "Garmin" piece of paper hanging on their wall).
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Are you saying that the Dynon AP installed in the same model aircraft works and Garmin doesn't?
On the other hand, not fair to malign Garmin products if it's an installation problem. Shops hire folks that often have very little experience, and the good mechanics/avionics folks usually move on to bigger outfits to make better money. My car repair shop charges more than most aircraft repair shops, and salaries are lower as well so guess what?
 
I called VPX the other day because a bad battery hookup (my fault) caused a dead short. It fried the fuses on my SL30 Ang Garmin did a flat rate exchange repair for $1000 through Sarasota Avionics.
My VPX on the other hand had a cable track fried. I’m called and got a new guy that knew nothing but was friendly. After relaying several questions and answers he said yes it sounds like it is the VPX but it. Is to expensive to repair it. Have a nice day. Now I acre wiring everything for buss bars and breakers.
 
Needing some experience/advice. I am trying to get position data from a Firgelli Actuator for flaps to function with my VPX Sport and Garmin G3x installation. Anyone with experience taking the 3 wire "feedback" from the firgelli and using that information to feed the VPX flap position data instead of a Ray Allen Pos 1.2? Thanks in advance.
 
penguin said:
GAD27 is higher integrity than a VPX, I would use the GAD
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Wow, just put a knife in and twist it. Of course, the trim and flaps aren't very important so we didn't put much thought into those sub-systems. 😏
 
MCA said:
Wow, just put a knife in and twist it. Of course, the trim and flaps aren't very important so we didn't put much thought into those sub-systems. 😏
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Thanks for weighing in, Marc. I've read your book many times and found it invaluable.

I'm installing a VP-X and a GAD 27 in my RV-10. The primary, number one reason is that the RV-10 requires five flap positions and the VP-X only supports four. I have an RV-10 builder friend that installed only the VP-X and really regrets not installing the GAD 27 for this reason alone. I, and he, have asked the representatives at the VP-X booth at the shows about this and were promised it would be addressed, but this hasn't happened for several years now.

The VP-X provides valuable services to an airplane, and to a pilot, and that's why I'm installing one of those, too. But if you're building an RV-10 is seems like you must install a GAD 27. IMHO.
 
TedC said:
Thanks for weighing in, Marc. I've read your book many times and found it invaluable.

I'm installing a VP-X and a GAD 27 in my RV-10. The primary, number one reason is that the RV-10 requires five flap positions and the VP-X only supports four. I have an RV-10 builder friend that installed only the VP-X and really regrets not installing the GAD 27 for this reason alone. I, and he, have asked the representatives at the VP-X booth at the shows about this and were promised it would be addressed, but this hasn't happened for several years now.

The VP-X provides valuable services to an airplane, and to a pilot, and that's why I'm installing one of those, too. But if you're building an RV-10 is seems like you must install a GAD 27. IMHO.
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I didn’t realize my RV-10 required 5 flap positions ? Only use 3 since reflex is a waste of a push? 5 ? Let me know what I have been missing ?? I installed after the fact a GAD 27 to get added discretes, period. Maybe I missed something not having 5 flap positions? Next RV I’m looking to have at least 7 flap positions. 😬
 
TedC said:
Thanks for weighing in, Marc. I've read your book many times and found it invaluable.

I'm installing a VP-X and a GAD 27 in my RV-10. The primary, number one reason is that the RV-10 requires five flap positions and the VP-X only supports four. I have an RV-10 builder friend that installed only the VP-X and really regrets not installing the GAD 27 for this reason alone. I, and he, have asked the representatives at the VP-X booth at the shows about this and were promised it would be addressed, but this hasn't happened for several years now.

The VP-X provides valuable services to an airplane, and to a pilot, and that's why I'm installing one of those, too. But if you're building an RV-10 is seems like you must install a GAD 27. IMHO.
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What five flap positions would those be?

Reflex, Zero, half and full...works fine.

...and reflex isn't needed or necessarily desired, so you could actually use only three.
 
TedC said:
Thanks for weighing in, Marc. I've read your book many times and found it invaluable.

I'm installing a VP-X and a GAD 27 in my RV-10. The primary, number one reason is that the RV-10 requires five flap positions and the VP-X only supports four. I have an RV-10 builder friend that installed only the VP-X and really regrets not installing the GAD 27 for this reason alone. I, and he, have asked the representatives at the VP-X booth at the shows about this and were promised it would be addressed, but this hasn't happened for several years now.

The VP-X provides valuable services to an airplane, and to a pilot, and that's why I'm installing one of those, too. But if you're building an RV-10 is seems like you must install a GAD 27. IMHO.
Click to expand...
Thank you, glad you found the book helpful. 😀

We did build the VP-X software to accommodate the RV-10. I'm not sure you need 5 positions. The VP-X does account for the reflex position, unique to the RV-10. Details are in the manual.

Also, we did consider intermediate stops during/when flaps are raised. However, this is really only needed on a go around so that flaps are not raised too fast thereby dumping lift too fast. Rather than make the pilot do multiple flaps up commands during this busy time, the system automatically raises the flaps at half speed if the engine RPM is high. So you just press the flaps up once and it is all automatic.

If you do want to stop the flaps on the way up, just bump the flap down switch and they will stop. Easy peasy.
 
“Details in the manual” - why didn’t I think of that 🤣.
Seriously though, Marc, you developed an amazing product - it’s no wonder I’ve been using & installing the VPX units since ~2013.
Happy days😉. Jake.
 
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rocketman1988 said:
What five flap positions would those be?

Reflex, Zero, half and full...works fine.

...and reflex isn't needed or necessarily desired, so you could actually use only three.
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For me, it's Reflex, Zero, 1st notch, 2nd notch, and Full. The 1st and 2nd notches can be set to whatever angle you want them to be. This is what I'm used to, in basically every plane with flaps I've ever flown (minus the Reflex). I like smaller increments, and believe it makes for gentler handling of the airplane on a landing approach. If you're fine with four positions, or even three, then that's great, go for it. These are experimental and you can do what you want; I did say "IMHO". But my friends with -10's say they'd prefer having the extra position on the way to flaps down. The GAD 27 is only a few hundred dollars, and you'll have more options, for this and for other functions, too. But you still need circuit breakers, so the VP-X is there as well; I love the control and the information it provides.

My airplane isn't finished yet, so I can't speak to the true value of Reflex and whether I'll really need it, but it's there, designed-in by Van's, and I'm going to support it.
 
TedC said:
For me, it's Reflex, Zero, 1st notch, 2nd notch, and Full. The 1st and 2nd notches can be set to whatever angle you want them to be. This is what I'm used to, in basically every plane with flaps I've ever flown (minus the Reflex). I like smaller increments, and believe it makes for gentler handling of the airplane on a landing approach. If you're fine with four positions, or even three, then that's great, go for it. These are experimental and you can do what you want; I did say "IMHO". But my friends with -10's say they'd prefer having the extra position on the way to flaps down. The GAD 27 is only a few hundred dollars, and you'll have more options, for this and for other functions, too. But you still need circuit breakers, so the VP-X is there as well; I love the control and the information it provides.

My airplane isn't finished yet, so I can't speak to the true value of Reflex and whether I'll really need it, but it's there, designed-in by Van's, and I'm going to support it.
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I can understand your points and everyone can build what they want. Not sure you are going to see any “smoother” transition; the -10 is pretty smooth, anyway. As far as reflex goes, I have it programmed but do t really ever use it. Have done testing during my typical mission profiles and it doesn’t make a substantial difference in any performance envelope that I typically fly in. There are several others who have done the same and have found the same conclusion. While it may look good from an engineering standpoint, reality is a bit different.
 
TedC said:
For me, it's Reflex, Zero, 1st notch, 2nd notch, and Full. The 1st and 2nd notches can be set to whatever angle you want them to be. This is what I'm used to, in basically every plane with flaps I've ever flown (minus the Reflex). I like smaller increments, and believe it makes for gentler handling of the airplane on a landing approach. If you're fine with four positions, or even three, then that's great, go for it. These are experimental and you can do what you want; I did say "IMHO". But my friends with -10's say they'd prefer having the extra position on the way to flaps down. The GAD 27 is only a few hundred dollars, and you'll have more options, for this and for other functions, too. But you still need circuit breakers, so the VP-X is there as well; I love the control and the information it provides.

My airplane isn't finished yet, so I can't speak to the true value of Reflex and whether I'll really need it, but it's there, designed-in by Van's, and I'm going to support it.
Click to expand...
Like Bob I've had time on my Florida-Ohio twice a year trek to compare reflex (In trail) and found zero difference in performance. If Vans had a plan I think they would provide data for us to use at different altitudes, temp, density, etc... There are a lot of very talented builders, engineers and for sure someone would have come up with some 3-dimensional chart that would provide recommendations for the use of reflex or in trail. The 10''s flaps are very docile which surprised me because they are significantly proportional larger than the 14's flaps and much more docile. (Both share the same aileron length just the flap account for the added length) I use 4 settings. Flaps up against the spare (reflex) then down maybe 10 degrees, down ~25 degrees and full down. Aside from a very slight pitch change flaps 3 and 4 doesn't change much. Even full flaps the airframe is capable of an easy 500 fpm go around. One nice thing since the VPX thinks -10 degrees is not speed limited (programmed as reflex but not reflex) can use that without being locked out like flaps 3 and 4 setting. (I do get a CASS message if I lower the flaps greater than 110)

As others have said build and fly what you want.
 
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Agree with the others that I see no real world difference between reflex and 0.

Because the flap speed is relatively low compared to the airplanes enroute and terminal speed, in reality I don’t start with the flaps until I’m either turning base or past the FAF on and approach so tend to just skip all the steps and get them out all the way more or less continuously and trim as required. It’s slow and smooth. I can’t remember ever really stopping somewhere in the middle other than maybe a howling cross wind so I could definitely live with less stops.
My 7 had no fancy stops along the way- just looked out the window and flaps as required.
 
Richard Connell said:
Agree with the others that I see no real world difference between reflex and 0.

Because the flap speed is relatively low compared to the airplanes enroute and terminal speed, in reality I don’t start with the flaps until I’m either turning base or past the FAF on and approach so tend to just skip all the steps and get them out all the way more or less continuously and trim as required. It’s slow and smooth. I can’t remember ever really stopping somewhere in the middle other than maybe a howling cross wind so I could definitely live with less stops.
My 7 had no fancy stops along the way- just looked out the window and flaps as required.
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All very interesting comments about real-world flying of the RV-10, things I've not heard at all before. Richard's comment makes an argument that you don't need intermediate flap steps at all - almost heresy, it seems, but the RV-10 is its own airplane with its own characteristics. I guess I'll have to wait to fly to really see what works for me, but in any case we can adjust and change the flap settings with software, which is a real benefit. And it doesn't hurt me to have extra capabilities.

Then we could talk about the differences between the VP-X and GAD 27's handling of 'flaps up' commands, which seem to be significant. So again I think it's good to have the option to use either the VP-X or GAD 27 to handle flaps and trim based on what's important to me.

Thanks for everyone's frank comments about RV-10 flight behavior.
 
Looks like the website is "Access Forbidden" as of today.

It isn't clear to me how much re configuration one can do without the online "configurator".

This box is basically a MOSFET multichannel switch with configurable current limits. Anyone interested in an alternative?

A 3 thousand dollar write off. Dang. Funny how the website dependence was designed in to force instantaneous product obsolescence.
 
Walt, I can log in (just did again at 7:30CST), but I'd ask why are you not just reprogramming directly to the VPX? That's what I did.
 
Walt D said:
It isn't clear to me how much re configuration one can do without the online "configurator".
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I didn't realize Vertical Power had an online configurator. I configure my VPX locally with no internet connection. I realize their website is down as I write this. My guess is they either pushed out a bad website update or they have an expired certificate. Who knows? Not needed to update the VPX so no biggie.
 
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