What's new
Van's Air Force

Don't miss anything! Register now for full access to the definitive RV support community.

Anyone else regret not installing a parking brake?

jcarne

jcarne

Well Known Member
Patron
Well I didn't install a parking brake and considering where I live (windy Wyoming) I regret it quite often when I have to dig in the back for my chocks and run out of the plane as quickly as I can before it starts getting some roll speed. Not too long ago I was actually found sprinting down the KCOD ramp for about 200yds chasing my tiedown bag; it would inch closer to me, then a gust would come up and say "not today!". Enjoy your new home amongst the sage brush tiny black bag. I'm sure I looked like a real fool that day. haha

Looks like I finally have a summer project. :ROFLMAO:

Something to think about for those of you building.
 
I live in wichita where we see our fair share of wind and installed one for that same reason. The only caution I have is that unlike most "big" airplanes that use a one way check valve for a parking brake, the matco option is a simple on/off ball valve setup. You stomp the pedals, pull the knob and what you get it what you get. If it's not enough, you can't step on the pedals and get more brake without turning the valve back to the off position.
 
There have been times when I wished that my RV-12 had a parking brake -- mainly to give me time to hop out and chock/tiedown the plane during windy days on the ramp or on sloped aprons. In my 58 years of piloting small aircraft I have found that one should not rely on aircraft parking brakes for parking -- most seem to bleed off pressure over time and are then a fender (wing) -bender waiting to happen.
 
I met a fellow that may of wished he hadn't installed a parking brake. After noticing a rather smashed up looking Kitfox airplane, asked the owner what happened? The owner of the Kitfox had taken a friend up to go parachuting. The guy doing the parachuting was working his way out onto the big bush tire to use as the launching pad, the pilot kindly applied his parking brake to make things easier for the jumper to get positioned on the tire.
Unfortunately, the pilot had forgotten he had applied the parking brake and apparently was not on the pre-landing check list...
 
jcarne said:
Well I didn't install a parking brake and considering where I live (windy Wyoming) I regret it quite often when I have to dig in the back for my chocks and run out of the plane as quickly as I can before it starts getting some roll speed. Not too long ago I was actually found sprinting down the KCOD ramp for about 200yds chasing my tiedown bag; it would inch closer to me, then a gust would come up and say "not today!". Enjoy your new home amongst the sage brush tiny black bag. I'm sure I looked like a real fool that day. haha

Looks like I finally have a summer project. :ROFLMAO:

Something to think about for those of you building.
Click to expand...
Parking brakes are so underrated.
Grab a cold bottle of Coke and sit back -
 
Richard RG said:
...Unfortunately, the pilot had forgotten he had applied the parking brake and apparently was not on the pre-landing check list...
Click to expand...

Yeah, that's kind of a big deal on a tail dragger. I set up mine to display a CAS message when the lever on the valve body is anywhere other than 100% off.
 
After going to a lot of trouble to install a Matco valve on the cabin side of the firewall (not flying yet), for a retrofit I'd recommend looking at the Beringer solution. Valve mounts to the rudder pedal pivot block bolts.
 
I have always carried wheel chocks and tie downs and looking back over the decades can't remember ever engaging a parking brake on an airplane, so that colors my understanding of the necessity of such a device. The OB of my airplane did install a parking brake but recommended to never use it...risking a problem with being able to disengage it as he had experienced. I've taken him at his word and never even tried it, and have found no need. Chocks and tie downs, avoid the half measure IMHO.
 
I have chocks easily accessed and use them whenever I park my plane on the ramp. Simple and a positive stop to keep airplane from rolling.
 
I'm not advocating using a parking brake and walking away, but they come in handy for the time between shutdown and being able to get chocks under it. Specifically if I'm on a sloped ramp or if the wind is ripping, as in the OP's original question.

I've discovered that if it wants to start rolling, I'm now too old to scamper out like a spider monkey and get chocks under a low wing in a timely fashion. That's why I installed one. On a high wing, then yeah, I wouldn't go to the effort.
 
Desert Rat said:
I'm not advocating using a parking brake and walking away, but they come in handy for the time between shutdown and being able to get chocks under it.
Click to expand...

Even the big airplanes get chocked in addition to the parking brake being set.

My Matco valve is more like the parking brake on a big airplane vs a simple ball valve - it is indeed a check valve. I can put it on, add more brake pressure, and it will hold it.

I use it every flight.
 
Desert Rat said:
I'm not advocating using a parking brake and walking away, but they come in handy for the time between shutdown and being able to get chocks under it. Specifically if I'm on a sloped ramp or if the wind is ripping, as in the OP's original question.
Click to expand...

Bingo, when the wind gets ripping 30+ kts the plane will start rolling quite quickly, not giving a lot of time to chock it, then when you scramble out you sometimes have to fight it back into correct tie down position.
 
I have a modified (2 tabs) Bogart tow bar that goes over the rudder bar, under the brake pedals, to use as a gust lock (-10). The same set up works as a temporary parking brake, just insert the tabs high up on the brake pedal. Traveling solo, I keep the tow bar within reach, behind me. With passengers, I just have them hold the brakes until I get the wheel chocks installed.
 
I have a parking brake. It was not hard to install, and I did use it once. If you are considering not installing it, I'd just do it - not expensive, easy to install when you are at that stage in the build, and if you don't want to use it, just don't. Perhaps there will be a time you need it, or the next owner might need it.
 
I am installing on in my 10. I decided to after I was solo on a sloped ramp with wind blowing in my 6a and having to jump out and quickly get the chocks in. Don't want to do that again
 
I don’t have a parking brake installed but there have been several times where I wish there was one.

The latest was last week refueling the aircraft. It was a typical windy spring day in Oklahoma with winds 20 mph gusting to 30/35. I pulled up next to the fuel pump, grounded the plane and pulled the hose out next to the wing. Turned around to put in my credit card, entered the appropriate data into the card reader then turned around to refuel the plane.

It had turned 90 degrees - weather vaining into the wind running over the ground wire and fuel hose. Had to pull the hose back around to start refueling. Once refueling was complete, I then had to push the aircraft back because there wasn’t room to start engine and taxi. Of course a C182 with two young pilots pulled up making it more difficult to push back!

I’m the second owner therefore not the builder. Most of the time not having a parking brake isn’t an issue but there have been times where I’ve wished there was one. If I was building that is one item I would definitely include.
 
The hardest part of my install was attaching the switch to tell the G3X that the parking brake is on. I feel this warning is a must because a landing with the brake on could be a bad day.
 
I decided to install the parking brake after offering a ride in my friend's RV8A. When he pulled up to the pump, we were at a slight incline so he asked me to step and chock the wheel so the plane did not roll back.
I use the parking brake every time I started the engine, to prevent it from accidentally rolling forward. This is even more critical when I do hot start where the initial RPM tended to be higher than the normal start.
 
My first plane didn’t have one and there were times when flying solo I wish I had one. The current plane I’m building has one.
 
Never had one on an RV (I’ve had 6), and haven’t actually thought I needed one - usually. My chocks are handy while seated in the cockpit, but there may be times on a windy day, or when parked on a sloped ramp when you might wish you had it. I’ve had a few local buddies that had the parking valve, and all but one of them had some problems - mostly leaks, probably installation error. In the airlines we ALWAYS set the brakes when we came to a stop. However, when we parked at the gate, or elsewhere, and got the chocks in signal from the ramp, we released the brakes - because of heat. After you land, the brake temperature reaches a max about 15-20 minutes after you land (on an airliner) - probably much less than that on an RV since we only have one disc usually, but when you do a quick turn on a hot windy day, you may want to limit your parking brake useage. Better to use chocks in this situation after you’ve parked.
 
Scott Hersha said:
Never had one on an RV (I’ve had 6), and haven’t actually thought I needed one - usually. My chocks are handy while seated in the cockpit, but there may be times on a windy day, or when parked on a sloped ramp when you might wish you had it. I’ve had a few local buddies that had the parking valve, and all but one of them had some problems - mostly leaks, probably installation error. In the airlines we ALWAYS set the brakes when we came to a stop. However, when we parked at the gate, or elsewhere, and got the chocks in signal from the ramp, we released the brakes - because of heat. After you land, the brake temperature reaches a max about 15-20 minutes after you land (on an airliner) - probably much less than that on an RV since we only have one disc usually, but when you do a quick turn on a hot windy day, you may want to limit your parking brake useage. Better to use chocks in this situation after you’ve parked.
Click to expand...
Ya, parking brake only used for chock setting. Also not a good idea to keep one set on the ramp in case a line guy wants to move the plane.

Ironflight said:
There’s a placard on my hangar door that says I can’t open it above 30 knots! Just sayin’…… ;)
Click to expand...
Haha I like that.

It's amazing how fast wind can change around here; happens a lot too, especially in spring. I have taken off from KWRL headed to KCOD with metar reporting 10 kts, nothing in the TAF and then bang, dial up the AWOS and hear 27G35. Whelp, good thing these RVs have big rudders. :ROFLMAO:

Then there is Casper, that wind is a routine beast. Part of the reason I think it would be cool if they got picked for the air races.
 
No, and no.
There have been a few times it would have been nice, but I just didn’t want one more thing to operate and maintain.
If I lived in Casper, I would be fishing the Miracle Mile and Greys Reef, not flying, so, still no!
 
Didn't install a parking brake. I built an attachment for my Anti-Splat-Aero "Ultimate Gust Lock" that applies pressure to the brake pedals with gas shocks. It works great, but I haven't needed it yet.
 
MacCool said:
The OB of my airplane did install a parking brake but recommended to never use it...risking a problem with being able to disengage it as he had experienced. I've taken him at his word and never even tried it, and have found no need.
Click to expand...

I used to have the Matco parking brake (PVPV-1 in my case) "stick on" after releasing the parking brake. Depressing the "stuck" brake pedal released the "stuck" brake every time, but still not reassuring behavior. I had a lengthy discussion with Matco on this topic.

According to Matco, best practice is to depress the brake pedals before relasing the parking brake to minimize differential pressure across the parking brake O ring. If there has been a history of not doing that, and sticky brakes resulting, it's probably wise to replace the parking brake O rings, which may be distorted (mine were). I replaced my parking brake O rings several years ago, adopted the "press brake pedal, then release parking brake" procedure. I've had no problems with the parking brake since.
 
Doing the brake caliper SB I looked over the whole system and noticed a tiny bit of brake fluid seeping on one of the master cylinders and at one of the parking brake connections. I almost pulled the parking brake off for good but my A&P/IA buddy convinced me to just rebuild it cause there may be a time I need it. So I contacted Matco and got a rebuild kit for $25. I’ve never used it in my -8 but there was a time years ago in a different airplane doing a refueling stop on a windy day on a cross country that got very interesting.
So now I am rebuilding the parking brake, both master cylinders, removing the firewall reservoir and the plastic lines and fittings and mounting the brake reservoirs on the master cylinders like many have done. That was 5 connections from the reservoir to the brake cylinders and now I have two so less potential for leaks IMO. I have good access now after watching a YouTube video of The RV-8 Pilot’s channel showing Man O War with the access panel on the front baggage floor with 1/4 turn fasteners and I shamelessly copied it.
 
Last edited:
i have installed the matco on both my builds. i don't use it very often but it works well. in my mind it is not a replacement for chocks or tie downs but it is handy for a quick out and back into the airplane after a landing. come to think of it didn't pipers have emerg. brakes at some point?
 
After a trip out to Oregon, enjoying lots of flying around the Pacific coast, I plan on retrofitting a parking brake in my plane. He and I were flying around in some very nasty winds. We landed at one of the airports along the coast and the winds were atrocious! The plane was bouncing around with us in it while sitting still! My son had to hold the brakes while I deplaned and tried to get it tied down. I'm not sure how things would have turned out if he or I had been solo. No possible way to get out and chock or tie it down if we and been solo. It taught me a lesson, I need a parking brake!
 
graywoodworking said:
Didn't install a parking brake. I built an attachment for my Anti-Splat-Aero "Ultimate Gust Lock" that applies pressure to the brake pedals with gas shocks. It works great, but I haven't needed it yet.
Click to expand...
Larry do you have a picture of this setup? I use the same gust lock, could be a good fix for my problem.
 
jcarne said:
Larry do you have a picture of this setup? I use the same gust lock, could be a good fix for my problem.
Click to expand...
Curious also. But, in lieu of a parking brake -
Can you install it while you’re in the airplane holding the brakes?

I’m not real excited about holding continuous pressure on the master cylinders for extended periods of time if that’s how it works.
 
JonJay said:
Curious also. But, in lieu of a parking brake -
Can you install it while you’re in the airplane holding the brakes?

I’m not real excited about holding continuous pressure on the master cylinders for extended periods of time if that’s how it works.
Click to expand...
Me thinks you could just put it on the brakes on the other side while you hold your own. Then go chock the plane and relocate the gust lock to not include the brakes.
 
jcarne said:
Me thinks you could just put it on the brakes on the other side while you hold your own. Then go chock the plane and relocate the gust lock to not include the brakes.
Click to expand...
Don’t have passenger side brakes for the same reason i didn’t put in a parking brake.
But, I like your thinking!
 
JonJay said:
Don’t have passenger side brakes for the same reason i didn’t put in a parking brake.
But, I like your thinking!
Click to expand...
Boy am I glad I did, never thought I would be a CFI. Now I actually prefer flying from that side and have never moved back, even when I'm solo. :ROFLMAO:
 
olyolson said:
Doing the brake caliper SB I looked over the whole system and noticed a tiny bit of brake fluid seeping on one of the master cylinders and at one of the parking brake connections. I almost pulled the parking brake off for good but my A&P/IA buddy convinced me to just rebuild it cause there may be a time I need it. So I contacted Matco and got a rebuild kit for $25. I’ve never used it in my -8 but there was a time years ago in a different airplane doing a refueling stop on a windy day on a cross country that got very interesting.
So now I am rebuilding the parking brake, both master cylinders, removing the firewall reservoir and the plastic lines and fittings and mounting the brake reservoirs on the master cylinders like many have done. That was 5 connections from the reservoir to the brake cylinders and now I have two so less potential for leaks IMO. I have good access now after watching a YouTube video of The RV-8 Pilot’s channel showing Man O War with the access panel on the front baggage floor with 1/4 turn fasteners and I shamelessly copied it.
Click to expand...
I am getting a little weep at the parking brake valve even right after the first flight. I don't jam the brakes before setting the parking brake anymore. I just press the pedal firmly enough to prevent the airplane from accidentally jumping forward at the engine start. When parking the airplane, the parking brake is off after the wheel chocks are in place.
 
This came with my rv12 as a rudder lock. After a fuel stop and pulling the cocks and as I opened my tip up canopy and the plane take off towards other planes with me running and finally getting inside and stopping it.( Quite the show) . I modified it too work as parking break and rudder gust lock. Wedge in between seat and break peddles on passenger side and Velcro around stick.simple and light weight!
 
I’ll try to get the attachments
 

Attachments

  • IMG_1855.jpeg
    IMG_1855.jpeg
    2.2 MB · Views: 42
olyolson said:
removing the firewall reservoir and the plastic lines and fittings and mounting the brake reservoirs on the master cylinders like many have done.
Click to expand...
Just curious - how do you check the brake fluid when they are behind the pedals? Seems rather inconvenient. I put my reservoir just inside the baggage area, so it's easy to check, and no firewall penetrations.

1713948181779.png
 
rv8ch said:
Just curious - how do you check the brake fluid when they are behind the pedals? Seems rather inconvenient. I put my reservoir just inside the baggage area, so it's easy to check, and no firewall penetrations.
Click to expand...
Easy, remove the access panel built into the front baggage floor. Don’t have a picture of mine but this one is from the Man O War RV-8 owned by The RV-8 Pilot. I basically copied this in my -8. And no more plastic lines
 

Attachments

  • IMG_1306.png
    IMG_1306.png
    3.3 MB · Views: 43
  • IMG_1305.png
    IMG_1305.png
    2.8 MB · Views: 47
I have no parking brake on my 9A Ive only had the aircraft for 9months Ive had one panic moment parking nose in to the pumps with the wind from behind. I had put my rudder lock on and tied the stick back with seatbelt.
Everything was fine, but opening the canopy (tip up) and stepping out, well, the aircraft just started rolling slowly towards the pumps. The canopy is like a sail. This resulted in panic and some rapid grabbing of the roll over bar, to stop it rolling into pumps and then climbing back in quick to get the chocks. Im still learning the ‘ways of the RV’ 🤣
 
olyolson said:
Easy, remove the access panel built into the front baggage floor. Don’t have a picture of mine but this one is from the Man O War RV-8 owned by The RV-8 Pilot. I basically copied this in my -8. And no more plastic lines
Click to expand...
Thanks - looks like camlocs holding on the access panel. Much easier than the 25 screws holding on mine. I'm still quite happy with having the single reservoir and the plumbing with the new quick fittings is very quick, easy, and has not (yet) leaked.
 
jcarne said:
Larry thanks for posting! That may very well be the easiest solution. I like that a lot.
Click to expand...
The contraption is a little awkward to get into place, just like the gust lock. With a little practice it gets easier. If you're like me and need a brake once a year, then no big deal. If you need a brake once a week, then I'd opt for installing a parking brake.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top