"We're glad to bring you an update on business operations and progress in the restructuring plan, some numbers around the reorder rates and shipping, plus some news about reopening factory tours and demo flights - among other things."
We have teams working on delivery schedules now, and will communicate that info as soon as we have it down solid. That is true for kits as well as engines and propellers.Certainly encouraging on the reorder ratio. Hopefully we can get some idea of anticipated delivery windows in the coming weeks.
What about Rotax? Always hear a lot about Lycoming but not as much about Rotax. I happen to have an RV-12iS fuselage waiting for an engine.We have teams working on delivery schedules now, and will communicate that info as soon as we have it down solid. That is true for kits as well as engines and propellers.
The Van's and Lycoming teams are working through the many details that define that schedule, and we don't yet have the details to share but as soon as it's available it will be communicated by Lycoming and/or Van's. I know both Lycoming's and Van's team have been overwhelmed with calls and emails asking about schedules -- Please know that as soon as the details are available you will hear from us, and our folks don't yet have the information to share. I'd just ask that you let the teams work on the details knowing they'll be reaching out as soon as they are able. They really want to be able to let you know and are working hard on the plan. Thank you for your patience on this!
Rotax engines are generally available with a fairly short lead time. The other components (many of them) of the powerplant kit vary in availability. But we are doing the planning for these and will be communicating the schedule as soon as we are able! The team is actively working on kit delivery timeline planning. We will certainly let everyone know when think of is all set and available.What about Rotax? Always hear a lot about Lycoming but not as much about Rotax. I happen to have an RV-12iS fuselage waiting for an engine.
Vans Aircraft is also in that same "Rock or a hard place" position. Nobody made a conscious choice to arrive at this point, but here we are and hard choices have to be made. The alternative is that you don't build a Vans Aircraft anymore - either because they don't exist, or you can't/won't accept the terms.93% engine reorder isn’t surprising given the “rock or hard place” scenario that builders found themselves in. I think a poll of “I didn’t want to get completely hosed” or “I’m glad to support with an extra 12% fee” will show that the 93% number isn’t a reflection of excitement but rather of self preservation.
Management made ALL the decisions that led to this point. That’s how we got here. Covid, supply chain etc etc , was not navigated successfully. Plenty of other companies that did navigate successfully.Vans Aircraft is also in that same "Rock or a hard place" position. Nobody made a conscious choice to arrive at this point, but here we are and hard choices have to be made. The alternative is that you don't build a Vans Aircraft anymore - either because they don't exist, or you can't/won't accept the terms.
Vans has at least managed to maintain a positive attitude in all their communications.
Great news Greg,You beat me to it, Doug.
A few facts and figures.
We stated in official documents that our target was at least 70% reorder rate. The reorders are still happening, and we've exceeded the target numbers. A few figures:
81% of kit orders have been renewed
78+% of kits reordered
93% of engines reordered
We can and will keep reorders open until 11:50PM Pacific time on Thursday, February 22nd. After that, all remaining open orders will be canceled.
Demos flights and tours at the factory in Oregon will start back up on March 4th. We look forward to seeing you!
This is probably the second most important thing they need - behind operating capital.How goes the selection/installation of an ERP system at Vans?
Management made ALL the decisions that led to this point. That’s how we got here. Covid, supply chain etc etc , was not navigated successfully. Plenty of other companies that did navigate successfully.
No, they didn’t actively engage in deliberate terrible decisions hoping for a terrible outcome. Pretty sure that’s not the consensus.
it’s not Covid or supply chains fault, those were just catalysts which revealed management’s shortcomings.
We’re here because they were not the right people for the job.
Results speak for themselves.
We stated in official documents that our target was at least 70% reorder rate. The reorders are still happening, and we've exceeded the target numbers. A few figures:
81% of kit orders have been renewed
78+% of kits reordered
We have teams working on delivery schedules now, and will communicate that info as soon as we have it down solid. That is true for kits as well as engines and propellers. The Van's and Lycoming teams are working through the many details that define that schedule, and we don't yet have the details to share but as soon as it's available it will be communicated by Lycoming and/or Van's. I know both Lycoming's and Van's team have been overwhelmed with calls and emails asking about schedules -- Please know that as soon as the details are available you will hear from us, and our folks don't yet have the information to share. I'd just ask that you let the teams work on the details knowing they'll be reaching out as soon as they are able. They really want to be able to let you know and are working hard on the plan. Thank you for your patience on this!
Greg this is all great news. My concern is that 9% of LCP have shipped, which doesn't seem like they are getting much attention? Also, I have yet to be contacted by anyone about my kits that I have been trying to work around bad parts & I'm fast approaching a work stop. On a different subject, the latest LCP list (7.2) seems to have parts missing from the RV-8 list? I appreciate all the work you and your team are doing in turning this around and wish you continued success.You beat me to it, Doug. A few facts and figures. We stated in official documents that our target was at least 70% reorder rate. The reorders are still happening, and we've exceeded the target numbers. A few figures: 81% of kit orders have been renewed 78+% of kits reordered 93% of engines reordered We can and will keep reorders open until 11:50PM Pacific time on Thursday, February 22nd. After that, all remaining open orders will be canceled. Demos flights and tours at the factory in Oregon will start back up on March 4th. We look forward to seeing you!
No kidding - “we want updates”, Vans provides them - and it turns into Vans sucks! Jeez -the glass isn’t even half empty - there was never anything in the glass. Makes me wonder why they still are here. Play golf!Why does every update take about 6 post to turn into bashing? Please can we stay on topic?
Couldn't agree more. The folks that have had it with this project have said everything there is to say. It's time to either move on, or stay in.Why does every update take about 6 post to turn into bashing? Please can we stay on topic?
Actually the fifth post?Why does every update take about 6 post to turn into bashing? Please can we stay on topic?
Just threw out a number, not a particular post.Actually the fifth post?
Go read the Engine, Prop thread!Just threw out a number, not a particular post.
I’m in the same boat. Is there anyone at Van’s or Lycoming who can give us even a ballpark figure? Greg???I am still waiting to order an Engine / propeller. I want to know the delivery time.
In the video they mention that the recovery plan will be filed in March.Thanks for the update to show that the brave are still there and working hard to keep the flag flying. I liked that this video felt authentic and not too scripted.
I hope that there will soon be a future update to introduce the current management team. We know from court documents that there is a new CEO and CFO and COO. It would be good to hear their thoughts and philosophies on what they are planning to do to help return Van's to a reliable and profitable organization. The Consultant has been working with the tribe for several months now and they must have formed a reasonably good idea of what are their short term and long term priorities. Sharing some of this information would surely help the cause.
Yes, the plan is due March 4th currently. The court may give an extension if needed, however watching the video makes me want to think Van wants to get past this as quickly as possible. Before completion of the plan, all the claims must be vetted and tallied up. This includes the ESOP/ERISA claims. Van's has filed with the BK court to hire an additional special counsel to deal with the ESOP. We know that claims are likely to take several years to pay out, but Hammstreet was optimistic that they would be paid. The timeline will be in the plan. So now that I have accepted my new engine order (Rotax), back ordered parts are shipping, and an LCP replacement order is completed, all I have left to do is wait and be patient. It appears to me the folks at the factory are going full tilt to meet their obligations. I am happy to have seen the update, its a positive step in the right direction.In the video they mention that the recovery plan will be filed in March.
I see it a little differently. Everybody knows Vans made several poor decisions that lead to where we are now. Am I happy about that? Of course not. The problem I have is some folks just can't let go of this and continue to kick the horse loooooong after it's dead. Yes, people have a right to vent but it gets really old seeing the same negative posts over and over and over and over for months on end. Vans can't change the past and neither can we. It seems more constructive to focus on what Vans is now doing right - which is quite a bit! Should we cheer the company on or continue to criticize and break it down? At what point do we accept what happened and move on?Y’all act like we are all supposed to be happy and cheerful about it or keep our mouths shut.
100% The situation is a sh*t sandwitch from which we all are having a bite (none more so than the people at Vans). Posting infinite complaints about the same thing accomplish nothing and just spread the misery. It's time to get onboard or move on.I see it a little differently. Everybody knows Vans made several poor decisions that lead to where we are now. Am I happy about that? Of course not. The problem I have is some folks just can't let go of this and continue to kick the horse loooooong after it's dead. Yes, people have a right to vent but it gets really old seeing the same negative posts over and over and over and over for months on end. Vans can't change the past and neither can we. It seems more constructive to focus on what Vans is now doing right - which is quite a bit! Should we cheer the company on or continue to criticize and break it down? At what point do we accept what happened and move on?
And just so you know - this bankruptcy affects me too. The bankruptcy has cost me $22,942 to date. I'm guessing it will be $25,000 before it's done.
"It's unfortunate. Nobody wanted it, but it happened. Get over it. Move on."
They haven't yet finished the last new project (RV-15). New projects are not the focus of this particular time - survival is. They have to get out of the trap before worrying about the bait that got them there.The video had no mention whatsoever of new projects being started. It’s that part that concerns me.
I think the poster was curious about the number of new kits started - new tail kit orders. That is an important indicator.They haven't yet finished the last new project (RV-15). New projects are not the focus of this particular time - survival is. They have to get out of the trap before worrying about the bait that got them there.
Im not as concerned about new orders…yet. They have a pretty big backlog to work through that will take them some time. That should keep them busy and funds coming in for a while. How they deliver on the backlog and current orders is likely to sway new projects a few months from now. I expect there are plenty of people like myself that now have something to work on, but still have at least another kit to order that will help bridge current orders to completely new customers. Hopefully with several months of smooth running they can get some prospective customer off the fence.The video had no mention whatsoever of new projects being started. It’s that part that concerns me.
Valid point, I hadn't considered that angle. I think it's going to be pretty thin for a while - folks considering starting a new kit are going to have to get used to the new prices and check their numbers, make sure they still want to do this. On top of that, I personally would wait until Vans exits Chapter 11 successfully before starting a new airplane with them.I think the poster was curious about the number of new kits started - new tail kit orders. That is an important indicator.