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Engine, Prop and Avionics Update posted

I can understand Lycoming delivery issues but not the props and Rotax engines for the RV-12. The vendors can supply them in a few weeks and they could be shipped direct rather than double handled and double shipped. My November powerplant crating is now scheduled for August. I can not understand why they can not send what is available with the rest on back order so I can keep building. Rant over, just really want to fly the new 12 to Oshkosh.
 
mstrauss said:
"Start in Jan 2025". Ann told you they are not going to build any TB engines for Vans customers until 1/2025? That's the first I have heard that, most disappointing. What are they doing with the remaining 8 months of 2024?
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That's not right. People are getting their TB engines each month and Vans has been sending out finial notices for payment. I have a buddy that got his email last week for TB540 for July delivery. They are producing them but at a snail pace.
 
noahhl said:
If my read of the registration database is right, there are 862 aircraft with a 2023 manufacture date using Lycoming engines. 111 appear to be RVs, of 244 total E-ABs. For comparison, 245 were Cessnas, 158 were Piper.
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I would think Robinson helicopter consumes ~ 150-200 engines per year for the R-22 and R-44 and Cirrus probably consumes 50 per year for the SR20.
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cactusman said:
I think the problem is there was a huge order compression in Feb-April '22 as I recall that is when the next 10% price increase was announced so they got a flood of close to 300 orders all in a 30-60 day time frame.
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Not a problem, 300 orders at 10k a deposit = 3 million USD by April 2022.
 
didja said:
Just as everything else, the supply chain and lack of work force has hit lycoming just like everything else, I imagine.

I’m one of those 300 and I am not holding my breath for an engine before 2025….. my project is essentially on hold until I get an engine….
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I've slowed down my build as a result as well:( but I still plan to do some of the Service Bulletins and start installing antennas
 
I ordered a TB in Aug 2022 so I'm understanding I shouldn't see any movement on the engine front this year? I'd like to put the money to use on other things but now I'm anxious that this engine is gonna go up another 30% by the time they do build and ship it. I wish I could cancel the TB and switch to non-TB without losing my deposit.
 
squeakersc063 said:
I ordered a TB in Aug 2022 so I'm understanding I shouldn't see any movement on the engine front this year? I'd like to put the money to use on other things but now I'm anxious that this engine is gonna go up another 30% by the time they do build and ship it. I wish I could cancel the TB and switch to non-TB without losing my deposit.
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Also have a TB order that I wish could be switched to a non-TB. It would seem to make sense - everyone gets their money sooner, customers off their back. Maybe after chapter 11 there will be more flexibility? Wasn’t that an option last year around his time?
 
Another data point. I ordered my Thunderbolt CAS IO-540 engine June 2021 and Lycoming tells me it will be ready in a couple of weeks.

I’m also told they are pressing to clear the 2021 backlog as the first priority. For my engine there was an additional delay as the vendor provided CAS needed to go back.

My understanding is the Thunderbolt line was essentially closed from last April until this March as Van’s is ~98% of the customer demand.

Carl
 
I just got an unsolicited email from Vans regarding my 390 Thunderbolt engine order. It's scheduled to be built in Feb 2026. When I ordered it in April 2023 the lead time was 12 months. I figured with the bankruptcy disruption I probably had another 12-18 months to wait. Wasn't expecting two more years so I'm kind of bummed. I will finish my build (w/o the engine) WAY before that. But, it was really nice getting an update from Vans!

A snippet from the email I received:
"As of the date of this email, there are more than 400 engine orders for Van’s customers on Lycoming’s manufacturing schedule. The schedule for those engines runs through February 2026 for standard experimental (also called non-cert, or non-Thunderbolt) engine orders. For Thunderbolt engine orders, the production schedule is booked through June 2026."
 
bertschb said:
I just got an unsolicited email from Vans regarding my 390 Thunderbolt engine order. It's scheduled to be built in Feb 2026. When I ordered it in April 2023 the lead time was 12 months. I figured with the bankruptcy disruption I probably had another 12-18 months to wait. Wasn't expecting two more years so I'm kind of bummed. I will finish my build (w/o the engine) WAY before that. But, it was really nice getting an update from Vans!

A snippet from the email I received:
"As of the date of this email, there are more than 400 engine orders for Van’s customers on Lycoming’s manufacturing schedule. The schedule for those engines runs through February 2026 for standard experimental (also called non-cert, or non-Thunderbolt) engine orders. For Thunderbolt engine orders, the production schedule is booked through June 2026."
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I, also, got the unsolicited email from Vans late Sunday (5/5/2024). My non-TB engine (ordered April 2023) is due to be built around 4/1/2025.
So, two years. This, after Lycoming had contacted me last summer (2023) and said that the engine was due to be built that Fall.
In the meantime, my Hartzell CS prop is sitting in the box, with the grease separating. . .
At least, like Bertschb said, we finally are seeing updates from Vans/Lycoming on the status and that is really nice to know!
It also sounds like they have a handle on things, so that is encouraging also.
 
Yep…same Here so at least they are somewhat consistent.
ordered Oct ‘2023 and told sept 2024….then emailed and told Dec 2024 and now it’s Dec 2025.
 
Sounds like a batch of engine emails went out Sunday night. I ordered my TB YIO-360-M1B March '22. Just for reference at the time the price was $41,800 w/ dual emags. That was before the bankruptcy adjustment, etc, etc. My "expected" production month is Jan 2025 - 34 months after the order date. Then there is the time it takes to build and deliver the engine. Payment of the balance owed is requested 4 months before expected delivery according to the email.

I too have a prop sitting. I suppose I need to reach out to Hartzell to see what I need to do before flying since it's going to be at least two years between prop delivery and first flight. Has anyone looked into that yet?
 
NavyS3BNFO said:
Sounds like a batch of engine emails went out Sunday night. I ordered my TB YIO-360-M1B March '22. Just for reference at the time the price was $41,800 w/ dual emags. That was before the bankruptcy adjustment, etc, etc. My "expected" production month is Jan 2025 - 34 months after the order date. Then there is the time it takes to build and deliver the engine. Payment of the balance owed is requested 4 months before expected delivery according to the email.

I too have a prop sitting. I suppose I need to reach out to Hartzell to see what I need to do before flying since it's going to be at least two years between prop delivery and first flight. Has anyone looked into that yet?
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There is a current thread:
https://vansairforce.net/threads/long-term-storage-of-hartzel-prop-and-consequences.226656/unread
Does not look like there is very much we can do. Sounds like Brian's idea (sell it and buy a new one) might be the way to go.
 
bertschb said:
I had the same concern so I decided to sell my prop today. I'll buy another one in two years when my engine gets delivered.
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I assume that you have done the math….probably $1200 to do a reseal/degrease when you are ready to use it. If that is two years from now, and you have sold the current prop, then have to buy a new one, what will the new one’s price be? Rememebr, there is basically ONE prop company now (yes, there is MT, but they have their own issues), and prices have not gone up as significantly as on other things …. Yet. By guess is that keeping the current prop and then paying for a reseal when you’re ready to use it will put you ahead of buying a new one in two years. But that’s just a guess you would want to consider.
 
Ironflight said:
I assume that you have done the math….probably $1200 to do a reseal/degrease when you are ready to use it. If that is two years from now, and you have sold the current prop, then have to buy a new one, what will the new one’s price be? Rememebr, there is basically ONE prop company now (yes, there is MT, but they have their own issues), and prices have not gone up as significantly as on other things …. Yet. By guess is that keeping the current prop and then paying for a reseal when you’re ready to use it will put you ahead of buying a new one in two years. But that’s just a guess you would want to consider.
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Called Hartzel today. $1500 for a two blade reseal at the Piqua factory. May be less at an authorized shop.
 
Thunderbolt manufacture update for those who are waiting.

I received an email from Van's this week saying "Schedule Production Month Begins: 12/1/2024". The rest of the email talked about the process and the first-in/first-out methodology.

This is for an IO-540 Thunderbolt ordered 3/8/2022.
 
Anybody know if you can switch your classification and make a quick claim for the $3K and wait in line for the rest?

I renewed the engine order on their advise it would be built in Dec 2024, not 2026.
 
QuixoteAg said:
Anybody know if you can switch your classification and make a quick claim for the $3K and wait in line for the rest?

I renewed the engine order on their advise it would be built in Dec 2024, not 2026.
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Yep…same Here so at least they are somewhat consistent.
ordered Oct ‘2023 and told sept 2024….then emailed and told Dec 2024 and now it’s Dec 2025.

Dec 2025 as stated thread 466 now it's 2024? "Does any know what time it is", great song.
 
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