What's new
Van's Air Force

Don't miss anything! Register now for full access to the definitive RV support community.

Another reason to have 2 screens I suppose...

jcarne

Well Known Member
Patron
Okay, I opted for a one screen install because a second is largely useless these days with an iPad and ForeFlight. Well, the other day I was flying and my HDX came up with a "system event 5" error. It said it wasn't a grounding event but I contacted Dynon and they said send her in for a hardware repair. 10-15 day turn around they say. Dangit!!! Came at a really bad time too as I'm only about 1 month away from my CFI checkride.

Sooooo now I wait patiently since I can't fly without engine instruments. Kind of regretting not installing that second screen now. Just a thought for those debating the idea. haha
 
Interesting to read this today, I was just thinking about installing a stand alone engine monitor instead of running the data through the G3X system, with that and a stand by G5 I'd negate such an issue. Although I guess the standalone unit can also fail........:rolleyes:
 
I have 2 legacy GRT screens in my 7A... HX on my side and a HS on the other. On one trip, I was getting ready to return home and the HX wouldn't boot up. I tried several times.. nope... wasn't happening. The trip was 3.5 hours back and I just used the HS on the passenger side. Ending up having to send it back for repairs... so I was definitely glad to have the 2nd screen.
 
Ya redundancy saved you there. Luckily I installed the wiring for a second screen. Just need to save some pennies now. Lol
 
I'm putting in one screen only and am comfortable with the risk because there is a backup ASI and a standalone warning light for low oil pressure to be able to land safely. The problem is that a screen can fail because of some other failed component e.g. EMS black box or ADAHRS black box, or the network, so where do you stop at for redundancy?
Some repairers may offer a loan unit while the original item is being repaired, if the main issue is being grounded.
 
I've been there, too. I had always planned on adding a second screen, so it was an easy job to install another Skyview EFIS screen. I even added the secondary ADAHRS. More info here.
 
This same thing happened to a friend of mine with dual HDX in his RV-12. He called Dynon and they said just the primary display needed to be sent back for repair. Unit is ~ 5 years old and Dynon fixed for free saying they had some bad hard-drive comments when the unit was originally manufactured. Nice people...
 
There's another aspect(s) that is often overlooked, and that's what information is needed when in conjunction with what other information. In other words, how many screens.

In my Garmin G3X Touch system, I have two screens plus the GTN650 -- which is okay for textual information but too small to be useful for graphics.

Each of the 10" screens is run split screen mode, with engine instruments on the very outside of each screen, then flight instruments, then whatever "MFD" information towards the center of the airplane. This means that I have two screens available for miscellaneous displays (chart, map, traffic, and waypoint being most commonly used). And, yes, I'd like to swap out the 650 for the big-screen GTN750, but that would be a whole lot of work and expense

Lots of folks seem to run the flight instruments full screen. Especially with vertical tapes, this means that the screen real estate to either side of the tapes is wasted. (Yes, there is some minor value to peripheral vision roll cues). So why not run split screen all the time? The little inset windows are almost too small to be useful, and when you touch one to expand it, you're in split screen mode.

(I cringe when I see pictures of G3X installations where both sides are identically set up -- so much capability wasted. And until recently, Garmin marketing did not show the capabilities of their system, so they were under-selling it.)

I have run foreflight on an (early)iPad and it worked fine in the shade of the high wing Cessna, but it regularly overheated in the RV-8.

But in the RV-9A, why would I want foreflight on an iPad? I've got pretty much all I need built in. I do have foreflight on the iPhone for preflight use, and when I go IFR, the clearances I get are trivial so no need to upload them -- and I don't have the hardware on the screen to do it.

But I do run full screen when I'm shooting videos of the instruments. And full screen is marginally easier when hand-flying IFR with round gauges (they're bigger), until it's time to bring up any ancillary information, and then back to split screen.

Bottom line: there's good reason to rethink what information is used when. Don't succumb to the tendency to irrationally defend what hardware is in your airplane, figure out what really works.
 
Last edited:
Hey Jerome,

I can't help with the broke airplane issue, but I do know a thing or two about prepping CFI applicants.

Bummer that you can't fly right now, but really, you already know how to fly the airplane. it's all just private and commercial maneuvers from the other side. The focus should be about finding the teaching tools to go with the flying side.

I think I remember your'e a teacher already, so you've got a head start on that.

I've prepped lots of CFI applicants over the years and I don't think I've ever spent more than 15 hours or so in the airplane, and probably twice that on the ground making them practice teach me everything.

Doing it that way, I've never had one fail yet.
 
Bottom line: there's good reason to rethink what information is used when. Don't succumb to the tendency to irrationally defend what hardware is in your airplane, figure out what really works.

And there is today's bit of wisdom.
 
I'm putting in one screen only and am comfortable with the risk because there is a backup ASI and a standalone warning light for low oil pressure to be able to land safely. The problem is that a screen can fail because of some other failed component e.g. EMS black box or ADAHRS black box, or the network, so where do you stop at for redundancy?
Some repairers may offer a loan unit while the original item is being repaired, if the main issue is being grounded.

Very true, the ems could still fail and ground me but the screen has already done it once now. Hoping I just got a bad hard drive and that this isn't going to be a reoccurring theme. The risk of not being able to land isn't a big concern to me as I have a backup G5. I just don't like being grounded and a second screen would have prevented it this time.

This same thing happened to a friend of mine with dual HDX in his RV-12. He called Dynon and they said just the primary display needed to be sent back for repair. Unit is ~ 5 years old and Dynon fixed for free saying they had some bad hard-drive comments when the unit was originally manufactured. Nice people...

Ya mine is 2 years old. I'm also under the impression that maybe they just had a back run of parts as there are quite a few people on the Dynon forums with this issue.

There's another aspect(s) that is often overlooked, and that's what information is needed when in conjunction with what other information. In other words, how many screens.

In my Garmin G3X Touch system, I have two screens plus the GTN650 -- which is okay for textual information but too small to be useful for graphics.

Each of the 10" screens is run split screen mode, with engine instruments on the very outside of each screen, then flight instruments, then whatever "MFD" information towards the center of the airplane. This means that I have two screens available for miscellaneous displays (chart, map, traffic, and waypoint being most commonly used). And, yes, I'd like to swap out the 650 for the big-screen GTN750, but that would be a whole lot of work and expense

Lots of folks seem to run the flight instruments full screen. Especially with vertical tapes, this means that the screen real estate to either side of the tapes is wasted. (Yes, there is some minor value to peripheral vision roll cues). So why not run split screen all the time? The little inset windows are almost too small to be useful, and when you touch one to expand it, you're in split screen mode.

(I cringe when I see pictures of G3X installations where both sides are identically set up -- so much capability wasted. And until recently, Garmin marketing did not show the capabilities of their system, so they were under-selling it.)

I have run foreflight on an (early)iPad and it worked fine in the shade of the high wing Cessna, but it regularly overheated in the RV-8.

But in the RV-9A, why would I want foreflight on an iPad? I've got pretty much all I need built in. I do have foreflight on the iPhone for preflight use, and when I go IFR, the clearances I get are trivial so no need to upload them -- and I don't have the hardware on the screen to do it.

But I do run full screen when I'm shooting videos of the instruments. And full screen is marginally easier when hand-flying IFR with round gauges (they're bigger), until it's time to bring up any ancillary information, and then back to split screen.

Bottom line: there's good reason to rethink what information is used when. Don't succumb to the tendency to irrationally defend what hardware is in your airplane, figure out what really works.

Very very happy with running one screen and foreflight for all my IFR/chart needs. I also have a backup G5. Would just like to not be grounded right now. haha Oh well

Part of my decision in going with one screen was in my own exact words, "I'll never need that second screen". Well shoot...
 
Last edited:
Hey Jerome,

I can't help with the broke airplane issue, but I do know a thing or two about prepping CFI applicants.

Bummer that you can't fly right now, but really, you already know how to fly the airplane. it's all just private and commercial maneuvers from the other side. The focus should be about finding the teaching tools to go with the flying side.

I think I remember your'e a teacher already, so you've got a head start on that.

I've prepped lots of CFI applicants over the years and I don't think I've ever spent more than 15 hours or so in the airplane, and probably twice that on the ground making them practice teach me everything.

Doing it that way, I've never had one fail yet.

Terry thanks for the advice! Ya I realize most of preparing for this one is ground work and I have been straight spanking some hours in that area! I have been teaching a buddy of mine too that has medical issues but wants to fly. When I go up with my CFI to "teach" him the maneuvers he never really finds anything wrong, just pointers. So I seem to be on the right track, just don't like not being able to practice! You are correct, I am a teacher by trade so when I teach the maneuvers to him it honestly just seems second nature to me, but nobody is perfect, so practice I must. haha

I'm definitely the kind of guy that wants to be truly prepared for a checkride. Can't stand it when I see people go into checkrides just to see if they can pass with the minimum.
 
I have four screens in two different airplanes and had to sent back each screen at least once. It looks like the question is not if a screen is acting up but more like when. Sure a single EMS box can also fail but as said at some point redundancy has to stop. I prefer two screens but that´s just me.
 
I have two screens in my 6 but recently it occurred to me that I should look at the failure possibilities. I realised that if I wanted to cover all eventualities I would need dual alternators dual ADAHRS and dual EMS. The conclusion I came to was that if I had a failure away from home the ADAHRS would be the most inconvenient as it would have to come out and be sent back for service before I could move the aircraft home. I decided to instal a backup combined altimeter and ASI so at least I can get back to base to sort it all out. The EMS does provide a similar problem but the backup options are not quite as straight forward but I guess RPM and oil pressure are about all you need.
 
I have two screens in my 6 but recently it occurred to me that I should look at the failure possibilities. I realised that if I wanted to cover all eventualities I would need dual alternators dual ADAHRS and dual EMS.....

and also dual engines....
 
Back
Top