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  #1  
Old 11-23-2021, 11:45 AM
Draker's Avatar
Draker Draker is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Livermore, CA
Posts: 577
Default First engine start: Hardware store bolts through spars?

I still have my wings attached with long 7/16" hardware store bolts that have the threads ground off. I'd like to make sure there are no leaks anywhere, and no other reasons to pull the wings off, before finally replacing with the proper close tolerance bolts. I don't want to ever have to take those puppies out in the future. What tests can be safely done without the close tolerance bolts? I assume the fuel flow test is fine, but what about spinning the prop to get oil pressure? First engine start? Taxiing? At what point should those tight bolts go in for good?
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Livermore, CA
https://stiletto.smugmug.com/RV7
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RV-7A (N12VD): Finishing final tasks for engine-start and airworthiness!
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  #2  
Old 11-23-2021, 12:09 PM
PilotjohnS PilotjohnS is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Southwest
Posts: 1,830
Default Very Good Question

Very Good Question. Ideally i am in the same boat. i would like to do first engine start with hardware store bolts, and then pull wings and move to flight test airport where I will install proper hardware.
I don't think taxi tests will be good. Also, I think my insurance does not want any movement under own power unless ready for flight (signed off).
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John S

WARNING! Information presented in this post is my opinion. All users of info have sole responsibility for determining accuracy or suitability for their use.

Dues paid 2021, worth every penny

RV9A- Status:
95% done, 5% left to go
Electrical/Panel done
Firewall Forward 95% done (waiting on fiberglass to be done)
Fiberglass 5%
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  #3  
Old 11-23-2021, 01:16 PM
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Jetmart Jetmart is offline
 
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Location: Windsor, Ontario
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Default

I think you are fine to do first engine start and everything leading up to that.
I climbed up on my wings in the wing walk area many times without issue. They are not going anywhere.
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Glenn Martin
Windsor, Ontario
1942 Tiger Moth
2017 Waco YMF-5
RV-14 Kit # 140694
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  #4  
Old 11-23-2021, 02:04 PM
D-Dubya D-Dubya is offline
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Beaumont, Texas
Posts: 161
Default

Well, if you're done pulling the wings off, why not go ahead and put the close tolerance bolts in and torque 'em down? What's the downside to putting all of the correct bolts in? Maybe I'm leaning to the side of caution, but I would want ALL of the bolts that hold the wings on if the fuel lines are connected for an engine run. True, if you're just doing a run-up, there's really not much strain on those connections and you could do what you wanted. But if the ground-down hardware store bolts don't have nuts, your connection to the spars isn't as Van's designed and you could potentially have an unintended bending moment around that connection.

Just a thought, but why not wait until everything is about ready to fly, then perform an all up test with all of the connections finalized? After all, you're not going to have to pull the wings if the engine doesn't start. Just make sure you have the nut plates installed on the bottom fuselage skin before calling it a day. But I'm assuming you've got those in and have drilled the rear spar holes in accordance with the instructions.

And yes, check with your insurance carrier to see how they define "not in motion" (builder's insurance) versus in motion or an airworthy aircraft. First engine runs are memorable events, and usually for all the right reasons. But in the unlikely event that something goes south, you want to make sure the insurance has your back.
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Beaumont, TX
RV-7 N413WD
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  #5  
Old 11-23-2021, 02:29 PM
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rv8ch rv8ch is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Draker View Post
... I'd like to make sure there are no leaks anywhere, and no other reasons to pull the wings off, before finally replacing with the proper close tolerance bolts. ...
As others have said, I don't think at this point you will need to remove the wings to fix anything. I'd put in the final bolts and avoid starting the engine until you are really ready to fly.
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  #6  
Old 11-23-2021, 02:37 PM
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erich weaver erich weaver is offline
 
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Location: santa barbara, CA
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What would require wing removal at this point? Install the final hardware and be done.
Erich
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RV-7A
Santa Ynez, CA
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  #7  
Old 11-23-2021, 02:41 PM
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AlexPeterson AlexPeterson is online now
 
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Location: Ottertail, MN
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No problem with the standard bolts... But, engine start should be days before airworthiness paperwork and first flight. Why start the engine before everything else is done? Also, non-broken in cylinders are more prone to corrosion it's said.
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  #8  
Old 11-23-2021, 02:54 PM
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Draker Draker is offline
 
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Location: Livermore, CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erich weaver View Post
What would require wing removal at this point? Install the final hardware and be done.
Erich
Worried mostly about fuel leaks from the fitting on the tanks, but now that I think about it, you can remove the tanks without removing the wings, and it's probably easier (?!) Hmm, I'm getting convinced to just put the bolts in now.
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Livermore, CA
https://stiletto.smugmug.com/RV7
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RV-7A (N12VD): Finishing final tasks for engine-start and airworthiness!
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  #9  
Old 11-23-2021, 06:17 PM
PilotjohnS PilotjohnS is offline
 
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Location: Southwest
Posts: 1,830
Default Me thinks

I as thinking of getting first start done and then pulling wings off and send to paint before first flight
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John S

WARNING! Information presented in this post is my opinion. All users of info have sole responsibility for determining accuracy or suitability for their use.

Dues paid 2021, worth every penny

RV9A- Status:
95% done, 5% left to go
Electrical/Panel done
Firewall Forward 95% done (waiting on fiberglass to be done)
Fiberglass 5%
www.pilotjohnsrv9.blogspot.com
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  #10  
Old 11-23-2021, 06:46 PM
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Freakshow108 Freakshow108 is online now
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Eatonville WA
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Default Thread drift

Just curious, Iím at the same point as you. What your kit number is? Iím 74775. I like to see where Iím at amongst kit numbers and completions.
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