VansAirForceForums  
Home > VansAirForceForums

-POSTING RULES
-Advertise in here!
- Today's Posts | Insert Pics

Keep VAF Going
Donate methods

Point your
camera app here
to donate fast.


Go Back   VAF Forums > Main > Safety
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 01-03-2022, 09:03 AM
Dandlac58 Dandlac58 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Sierra Vista
Posts: 36
Default Egress in the RV7A in an inflight emergency

Hi Everyone,

You are having an emergency, such that you have determined your only option is to bail out of the airplane to save yourself.

I have read other posts which say you wont be able to open the canopy (slider) in the event you need to egress.

Is anyone aware of research done which indicates what your real options are in the event you need an emergency egress? Also, what about emergency parachutes?

I thank everyone in advance for their thoughts.

Paid in 2022... because you all are worth it!

Dan
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 01-03-2022, 10:34 AM
fl-mike's Avatar
fl-mike fl-mike is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,689
Default

  1. Ball detent pins in place of the roller weldment-to-frame bolts, with lanyards.
  2. Mini-Softie chute packed diaper-down for lumbar support (remove standard seatback cushion)

Egress = pull pins (FIRST!), unlatch and pull back canopy (hopefully!) enough to clear fairing lip, watch canopy fly away, headsets off, seatbelt release, JUMP!

Some remove the pins before takeoff, I don't (but you'd better remember to pull the pins first, or they'll bind up and then you are really stuck).

That's the plan and setup. Not tested, but it's better than no plan.

yes, fully sliding the canopy open will not work at any speed higher than stall or so. The lifting force binds the rollers. Ask anyone who has forgotten to latch the canopy if they were able to slide it shut after takeoff. I, of course, have never done that....
__________________
Mike W
Venice, FL

N164WM RV-6A Slider/O-360/FP Sold 4/2022
N184WM (RV-8) Final stages. Titan IOX-370
N184P reserved (RV-8QB) Empennage

Last edited by fl-mike : 01-03-2022 at 01:18 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 01-03-2022, 10:47 AM
Dandlac58 Dandlac58 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Sierra Vista
Posts: 36
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fl-mike View Post
  1. Ball detent pins in place of the roller weldment-to-frame bolts, with lanyards.
  2. Mini-Softie chute packed diaper-down for lumbar support (remove standard seatback cushion)

Egress = pull pins, unlatch and pull back canopy (hopefully!) enough to clear fairing lip, watch canopy fly away, headsets off, seatbelt release, JUMP!

Some remove the pins before takeoff, I don't.

That's the plan and setup. Not tested, but it's better than no plan.

yes, fully sliding the canopy open will not work at any speed higher than stall or so. The lifting force binds the rollers. Ask anyone who has forgotten to latch the canopy if they were able to slide it shut after takeoff. I, of course, have never done that....
HI Mike,

Thanks for the thoughts. It sounds viable. Do you have any photos of the ball detent pin setup you suggest?

Ok on the parachute. Thx.

I wonder if you could build a flap which would spring up in the event you open the latch, and the flap would create enough pressure to overcome the aerodynamic pressure which apparently works to keep the canopy closed at most speeds. PS... nice to know that you have "never" forgotten to shut the latch either!

Now, is it better to go inverted and fall out - I know going inverted is probably not something most of us do but it seems jumping out of an RV7A in normal flight is going to be pretty **** difficult with a possibility of also slamming into the rudder or hori-stabilizer?
__________________
Dan L
N327CD
2004 RV7 and RV7A (birthed as a 7A, then 7 from 2006 until this past October and now RV7A again - has all mounts, gear, brake plumbing for both configurations)
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01-03-2022, 10:57 AM
bjdecker's Avatar
bjdecker bjdecker is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Georgetown, TX
Posts: 1,135
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dandlac58 View Post
Now, is it better to go inverted and fall out - I know going inverted is probably not something most of us do but it seems jumping out of an RV7A in normal flight is going to be pretty **** difficult with a possibility of also slamming into the rudder or hori-stabilizer?
The tail is still there even if you are inverted

So, let me understand the thinking here -- you've encountered a situation where you need to leave the aircraft, yet you are going to have enough control to roll inverted, hold it, and then fall gracefully away from the aircraft? Why not just fly the airplane to the scene of the crash?
__________________
Brian Decker
RV-7 (Flying)

Last edited by bjdecker : 01-03-2022 at 11:00 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01-03-2022, 10:59 AM
airguy's Avatar
airguy airguy is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Garden City, Tx
Posts: 5,814
Default

Bailing out means the airplane is not even serviceable as a glider anymore - which means pretty much that it's either on fire, or completely out of control (loss of control surfaces or inflight breakup). Either way you are better off getting out ANY way you can, and quite possibly have no control (or time) to orient the aircraft in any particular way.

My 2 cents - if I have enough control to point the aircraft where I want it in the sky, and it's not on fire, I'm landing a glider.
__________________
Greg Niehues - SEL, IFR, Repairman Cert.
Garden City, TX VAF 2022 dues paid
N16GN flying 1,000 hrs and counting on 91E10; IO360, SDS, WWRV200, Dynon HDX, IFD440, G5
Built an off-plan RV9A with too much fuel and too much HP. Should drop dead any minute now.
Pending Repeat Offender - 10 kit is on order. TDI? Turbine? Stay tuned!
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01-03-2022, 12:42 PM
jcarne's Avatar
jcarne jcarne is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Worland, Wyoming
Posts: 2,170
Default

Not gonna lie, I kind of like the idea. Gliding an aircraft down can be a bad option at times. Would you rather glide or bail if you lose an engine over some seriously nasty mountains? Or at night over virtually anything other than farm lands? I try and flight plan to avoid mountain passings but if you look where I live itís pretty much impossible at times. Just a thought.
__________________
Jereme Carne
PPL
RV-7A Flying as of 03/2021
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01-03-2022, 02:12 PM
sailvi767 sailvi767 is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Charlotte NC
Posts: 1,449
Default

The probability of getting out of a RV in a out of control flight situation is virtually zero. Most underestimate how difficult just finding a single release handle can be in that situation. If the aircraft is flyable and you still want to jump a helmet would be a great thing to be wearing in addition to the chute. The tail is going to hurt! I believe that to date there has not been a single successful bailout from any RVís. I am aware of one person who manage to exit a RV 8 on fire however he was not wearing a chute. I donít know if the chute would have helped at the altitude he was at or if he hit the tail.
__________________
RV-6 sold
F-1 Rocket
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 01-03-2022, 02:14 PM
Dandlac58 Dandlac58 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Sierra Vista
Posts: 36
Default

BJDecker,

Well, thats not at all the thinking I had in mind. If you want to fly to the scene of the crash, by all means please do so! I'm trying not to do that.
On the other hand, the tail might still be there if you are inverted... duh... but you would be falling away instead of jumping up in to. If you are prepared, which is why you train, right, then quickly inverting, and falling out seems far easier a scenario, in two scenarios which are not all that good.
Seriously, your answer lacks seriousness... but I guess it's the thought that counts!! ;-)
__________________
Dan L
N327CD
2004 RV7 and RV7A (birthed as a 7A, then 7 from 2006 until this past October and now RV7A again - has all mounts, gear, brake plumbing for both configurations)

Last edited by Dandlac58 : 01-03-2022 at 02:22 PM. Reason: Clarification of whom I am responding to...
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01-03-2022, 02:16 PM
Dandlac58 Dandlac58 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Sierra Vista
Posts: 36
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by airguy View Post
Bailing out means the airplane is not even serviceable as a glider anymore - which means pretty much that it's either on fire, or completely out of control (loss of control surfaces or inflight breakup). Either way you are better off getting out ANY way you can, and quite possibly have no control (or time) to orient the aircraft in any particular way.

My 2 cents - if I have enough control to point the aircraft where I want it in the sky, and it's not on fire, I'm landing a glider.
Amen, my first option would always be to land it... but the scenario is not that... it is an emergency situation which dictates leaving the airplane to save yourself.
__________________
Dan L
N327CD
2004 RV7 and RV7A (birthed as a 7A, then 7 from 2006 until this past October and now RV7A again - has all mounts, gear, brake plumbing for both configurations)
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-03-2022, 02:18 PM
Dandlac58 Dandlac58 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Sierra Vista
Posts: 36
Default Nice!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RV8JD View Post
As others have, I replaced the front canopy bolts on my previous RV-8 with pip pins. These are the ones I used at the time:



Installed:



To my knowledge, there has been one exit of a pilot from an RV-8 in-flight. Unfortunately, the pilot was not wearing a chute.
https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/38485
Thanks for the post and the photo! Now I see clearly how to do it. I appreciate it!
__________________
Dan L
N327CD
2004 RV7 and RV7A (birthed as a 7A, then 7 from 2006 until this past October and now RV7A again - has all mounts, gear, brake plumbing for both configurations)
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:25 AM.


The VAFForums come to you courtesy Delta Romeo, LLC. By viewing and participating in them you agree to build your plane using standardized methods and practices and to fly it safely and in accordance with the laws governing the country you are located in.