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Waxed Lacing cord vs TyWraps?

rv6ehguy

Well Known Member
Good day fellow RV aviators,
I’ve never been a fan of the nylon Ty Wraps and prefer to use the waxed lacing cord. I know that you can use the Ty Wraps under the cowling but over time those Tys become brittle and depreciate. Can the lacing cord be used in the engine environment. Apart from the longer installation time, what’s the down side of using lacing cord? Thanks for your time.
John Van Lieshout
RV6A QB 85%
AeroSport Power IO-375 M1S 195hp
(Looking for a prop)
 
I have used the lacing cord under the cowl without any problems.

There is also a newer design zip tie made for aircraft use, has cushioned edges and is releasable as well as high temp use. Grip Lock brand. Amazon has them. https://griplockties.com/
 
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John - to put it as bluntly as I can... There is NO down-side to using lacing cord. Only up-sides.

To answer your specific question, yes, lacing cord is rated for firewall-forward use. Clearly one needs to turn the brain on before using it. It takes really special materials to live happily beside a glowing hot exhaust pipe - neither lacing nor zip ties will be happy there. Some common sense, when liberally applied, will guide where you route wire bundles, so keeping them away from hazards will generally keep them located in areas where lacing cord is a perfect choice.

Just for fun, make up a bundle of wires using zip ties. Any bundle of tefzel wires. Heck, you can even zip tie a coil of wire you've just purchased. Now leave those zip ties in place and tie a good lacing cord not beside them. You'll be amazed to see those once-tight zip ties will now be loose. Lacing cord is just better than zip ties when it comes to holding a wire bundle together.

For those who say "but Boeing uses zip ties", yes, that's absolutely true. But Boeing also bills for every person-hour of labour that goes into their product. We don't have that concern with our amateur-built airplanes, so lacing cord is the way to go.
 
...and

I would like to see a video of y'all doing lacing while on your back in the footwell of a -10, working on a 1" diameter bundles of wires with a flashlight in your mouth...:rolleyes::D
 
I would like to see a video of y'all doing lacing while on your back in the footwell of a -10, working on a 1" diameter bundles of wires with a flashlight in your mouth...:rolleyes::D

Never will happen! :D

I have enough problems seeing what I’m lacing with bifocals and my hands are busy lacing, flashlight in my mouth, so I’m not sure how to aim the Video camera.
 
Oil Soak

One down side to lacing cord in the engine compartment is that it does soak up oil over time and tend to loosen. If it does, I usually end up replacing it with some new lacing cord while the cowling is off for it CI.

At least that's my experience with my RV6 over the last 20 years and 2000 hrs.

Laird
 
I like lacing cord for NEW installations where it is easy to get at. I use TyWraps typically on rework or where it is just too hard for lacing cord.
 
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The word of the day is....

The word is Esoteric! Intended or likely to be understood by a small number of people with a specialized knowledge......like builders!

Forget all of the easy installation issues...the fact is lacing cord just looks COOL to me...like it took time, effort, some skill, etc..

It may sound silly, but lacing cord on a build reminds me of the nostalgia factor surrounding airplanes and the early days of aviation...not unlike goggles, silk scarves, etc....

Yeah, I may be crazy..but lacing cord rules!...Cheaper, better, cooler...Just do it....
 
Lacing cord holds up much better under the cowling than even the high-temp ty-raps. Takes more time to install, but it's worth it.
Once you tie a few hundred of them you can do it with your eyes closed, upside down, under the panel with a flashlight in your mouth. Wait. Whaat? :)

Lenny

Good day fellow RV aviators,
I’ve never been a fan of the nylon Ty Wraps and prefer to use the waxed lacing cord. I know that you can use the Ty Wraps under the cowling but over time those Tys become brittle and depreciate. Can the lacing cord be used in the engine environment. Apart from the longer installation time, what’s the down side of using lacing cord? Thanks for your time.
John Van Lieshout
RV6A QB 85%
AeroSport Power IO-375 M1S 195hp
(Looking for a prop)
 
Lacing cord holds up much better under the cowling than even the high-temp ty-raps. Takes more time to install, but it's worth it.
Once you tie a few hundred of them you can do it with your eyes closed, upside down, under the panel with a flashlight in your mouth. Wait. Whaat? :)

Lenny

If you don't have pictures, it didn't happen!:D:D
 
A page from Paul Dye wisdom

Dymo labels on the instrument panel make the modifications you implement much less traumatic.
Take it from me, everything you change behind the panel will get tie wrapped and will not nearly convey the merit and dedication you applied originally. Yes cord is a labor of love and says a lot about you. That said, I will probably cord my wiring again and cuss the tie wraps I install the first time I troubleshoot or modify something 😒
 
Method.2

I mostly use Method 1 with a square knot on top, from Bob's book:

http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/cable_lace/cable_lace.html

Lenny

I spent a lot of time in telecom.
Method 2 or a variation is what I use. Method 2 for a single wrap. Variation for a lash. I make the hitch knot on one end of the string, go around and pass through the hitch. Tie a square knot and start the lashing.
If there are sharp edges or potential chafing, I add a wral of self fusing silicone tape first.
Lashing string can cut wire so be careful with tension.
I've lashed and terminated a lot of wire in some really uncomfortable places. Thank goodness for LED head lights!
 
I would like to see a video of y'all doing lacing while on your back in the footwell of a -10, working on a 1" diameter bundles of wires with a flashlight in your mouth...:rolleyes::D
Been there, done that! I have even been in that position doing the lacing with one hand in the footwell of a 9! Much tighter than those massive 10 footwells. 😁
 
Just for fun, make up a bundle of wires using zip ties. Any bundle of tefzel wires. Heck, you can even zip tie a coil of wire you've just purchased. Now leave those zip ties in place and tie a good lacing cord not beside them. You'll be amazed to see those once-tight zip ties will now be loose. Lacing cord is just better than zip ties when it comes to holding a wire bundle together.
If you improperly install a Ty-Wrap, it will be loose. No different than if you improperly install lacing cord. Lace up whatever you like, and I'll pull a Ty-Wrap around it and make your lacing cord loose again too.

But But that's not what we want. We want security and anti-vibration/chafing.
Tightening either of them too tight will just cut into your wires.

After 12 years of using Ty-Wraps in the engine compartment on my -6, none have gone brittle, etched my engine mount, or worn through a wire housing. I have, however, replaced poorly installed inferior zap-straps that have failed in all of these ways.
 
The word is Esoteric! Intended or likely to be understood by a small number of people with a specialized knowledge......like builders!

Forget all of the easy installation issues...the fact is lacing cord just looks COOL to me...like it took time, effort, some skill, etc..

It may sound silly, but lacing cord on a build reminds me of the nostalgia factor surrounding airplanes and the early days of aviation...not unlike goggles, silk scarves, etc....

Yeah, I may be crazy..but lacing cord rules!...Cheaper, better, cooler...Just do it....

PLUS, you get to add another tool to your toolbox for removal. A seam ripper. Easily found in your wife's sewing box..:D
 
Q?. If you don't have pictures, it didn't happen
A. please do a Google search of "selfie of a Mars rover"
and you will see lots of lacing cord usage
.
good day /rick
 
High temperature rated lacing tape is available.

Fiberglass or Nomex woven tape. White or tan usually. I can't feel any wax in it but it does stay tied anyway.

I obtained a roll of the fiberglass version via military surplus many years before the build started so that's what I used firewall forward in many places.
 
I have had a lot of experience in electrical wiring (in terrestrial electronics wiring/cabling installations) and simply put, tie-wraps will fail sooner than later. If you tie-wrap something, (anything) such as cable bundle, and it is left outside, in the sun, the tie-wraps will fail sooner than later, definitely in less than a year. I can't predict how long they would last in an engine compartment, but with the heat and exposed to air, they won't last long. I would never use tie-wraps in anything that needs to be secured permanently.
 
I have had a lot of experience in electrical wiring (in terrestrial electronics wiring/cabling installations) and simply put, tie-wraps will fail sooner than later. If you tie-wrap something, (anything) such as cable bundle, and it is left outside, in the sun, the tie-wraps will fail sooner than later, definitely in less than a year. I can't predict how long they would last in an engine compartment, but with the heat and exposed to air, they won't last long. I would never use tie-wraps in anything that needs to be secured permanently.

It really depends on the quality of the tie-wraps you use - I have tie-wraps in engine compartments that have been there for fifteen years….

For wire bundles, mostly I use lacing cord to make bundles, and Adel clamps to secure them - but occasionally, a Tie-Wrap is the best thing to use.
 
How I bundle it:
Lacing cord used anywhere that I would have to shove my hands in for maintenance later. I like my skin, I hate band-aids.
Otherwise, areas that are hidden, awkward or easily worked around - tie wraps rule! I'm not trying to impress anyone.
 
Lacing for many practical reasons.

I wrestled with this decision in my build, and tried the ty-raps, the aviation type, with stainless tang. Even used a tensioner/cutter. The tensioner does not fit in small spaces, and handling lacing vs zipties in all positions etc was a lot easier than ty-wraps. The lacing is stronger, lighter, and has a higher temperature rating than the ty-wraps.

I despise the wax coating but highly recommend the latex coating, I use black, will edit with part number. Wax coated gets dirty, on my hands - - -just don't like it.
 
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I have had wax chord in the engine compartment of my 9A for 10 years now and still as clean and tight as the first day.
The wrap ties I used are also in great shape.
Hopefully not the commentators curse coming up.
 
John - to put it as bluntly as I can... There is NO down-side to using lacing cord. Only up-sides.

To answer your specific question, yes, lacing cord is rated for firewall-forward use. Clearly one needs to turn the brain on before using it. It takes really special materials to live happily beside a glowing hot exhaust pipe - neither lacing nor zip ties will be happy there. Some common sense, when liberally applied, will guide where you route wire bundles, so keeping them away from hazards will generally keep them located in areas where lacing cord is a perfect choice.

Just for fun, make up a bundle of wires using zip ties. Any bundle of tefzel wires. Heck, you can even zip tie a coil of wire you've just purchased. Now leave those zip ties in place and tie a good lacing cord not beside them. You'll be amazed to see those once-tight zip ties will now be loose. Lacing cord is just better than zip ties when it comes to holding a wire bundle together.

For those who say "but Boeing uses zip ties", yes, that's absolutely true. But Boeing also bills for every person-hour of labour that goes into their product. We don't have that concern with our amateur-built airplanes, so lacing cord is the way to go.

Have to disagree. Use what you want, what ever makes you feel good, both work well. I've been using black nylon Thomas & Betts zip ties, pulled with a Panduit puller, for 20 years. Slowly replacing beloved lacing as the arthritis in my hands got worse. Had the occasion to remove some of both today on an old job. Both were equally tight on the tefzel wire from which they were removed. Aesthetically, lacing wins every time. But properly applied, quality nylon ties work every bit as well.
 
I love the wax lace cord like most here. When I make up looms, I lace them. When making up wiring runs in the aircraft I use cheap and nasty zip ties to set the wiring shape/run, then when committed, I lace it and cut out the crappy zip ties. T&B Ty-raps certainly have a place as well, and are very convenient and strong.
My 2 cents worth…
 
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