To Build as ELSA or EAB

[smokediver576]

So..... someone recently corrected me on some misinformation I had been given, that a sport pilot could not fly an EAB LSA (according to what I've researched since, you can fly an EAB with a SPC as long as the airplane meets the LSA rules). So, since I'm in the middle of building my 2010 RV12 ULS kit, it got me wondering, should I continue as ELSA or jump over to the EAB route.

Curious of the pros and cons from the brain trust on here.

Thoughts?

Thanks!

[rvbuilder2002]

The three primary ones are -

A potential influence if you ever sell as an E-AB because the airplane wasn't necessarily initially built to a specific certification standard/configuration.

An E-AB can only ever have one repairman's certificate issued for it (authorizing a person to do the annual condition inspection). For an E-LSA any future owner can get a repairman's certificate by taking a 16 hr course.

Phase 1 flight testing for E-LSA is a minimum of 5 hrs.
Phase 1 for E-AB is 40 hrs or a task based flight test program that on average probably takes most people at least 25 hrs if they actually do all of the required tasks.

[Mel]

Originally Posted by smokediver576

So..... someone recently corrected me on some misinformation I had been given, that a sport pilot could not fly an EAB LSA (according to what I've researched since, you can fly an EAB with a SPC as long as the airplane meets the LSA rules). So, since I'm in the middle of building my 2010 RV12 ULS kit, it got me wondering, should I continue as ELSA or jump over to the EAB route.
Curious of the pros and cons from the brain trust on here.
Thoughts?
Thanks!

Pro for E-LSA...Subsequent owners may perform annual condition inspection if he/she completes proper training...5 hr Phase I.

Con for E-LSA...Builder must use all parts, including engine, avionics, etc. provided by kit manufacturer... Aircraft must be built EXACTLY IAW plans and instructions... Aircraft may not EVER be modified outside LSA parameters.

Pro for EAB...Builder may qualify to perform annual condition inspection simply by applying for Repairman Certification... Aircraft may be modified outside LSA parameters... Builder may use parts purchased from outside sources... Builder may use different instruments, avionics, etc.

Cons for EAB...40 hr. (or Task Based) phase I... Subsequent owners may not be qualified to perform annual condition inspection.

I've probably missed a thing or two.

[KeithO]

For EAB,it is critical that the weight and balance reflects the value needed to qualify it as an LSA (1320max gross). Furthermore in the recorded performance data, the values for stall with flaps and stall clean must meet LSA criteria. Then you will be issued an LSA compliant AW certificate.

Later in the life of the airplane, someone can make changes and increase the gross weight (no longer a LSA ) but the opposite (higher initial gross at time of AW cert) can never be "downgraded" to a lighter LSA compliant gross weight and be flown by a sport pilot.

This second point may not be very important in terms of the proposed Mosaic rule change, which may allow sport pilots to fly certain aircraft with higher than LSA gross weights and higher performance. But the fat lady has not yet sung on Mosiac so who knows what will be added to the rule before it becomes law ???

[PhatRV]

If you want a hotrod such as the Rocket, it can only be EAB

[SARLDO]

Originally Posted by Mel

Con for E-LSA[/b]...Builder must use all parts, including engine, avionics, etc. provided by kit manufacturer... Aircraft must be built EXACTLY IAW plans and instructions... Aircraft may not EVER be modified outside LSA parameters.

I wonder what will happen post MOSAIC. I suspect ELSA will be very similar to EAB regarding what you can do to the airplane. Thoughts?

[KeithO]

Originally Posted by SARLDO

I wonder what will happen post MOSAIC. I suspect ELSA will be very similar to EAB regarding what you can do to the airplane. Thoughts?

I doubt that anything regarding ELSA will change. It is a standard based on ASTM rules and the manufacturer making a "qualifying airplane" which the builder then has to duplicate.

EAB will be the way it always was. 40 hour restricted period, builder can maintain and sign off the conditional inspection. Non builder owner has to pay an A&P which is not terrible. You are still free to do all the maintenance, change avionics etc.

[12vaitor]

ELSA vs EAB really comes down to how you intend to build your airplane. If you are not going to make any major changes to the engine or avionics, there is no real reason to build as an EAB. You can modify an E-LSA however you want AFTER you get the SAW Certificate. There are limits to changes associated with keeping it an LSA (no flight adjustable prop, speed limit, gross weight limit, etc.).

If you want an engine other than the 912ULS, or a bunch of avionics that exceed the power capacity of the 912ULS, EAB would be the better choice. Those two items are what made the decision for me during the build. Other than the engine and avionics/wiring my EAB RV-12 is pretty much 100% KAI compliant. If you do go EAB, do not expect any help from Van's if you have a problem. I would guess that the EAB parts doubled my build time with all the design, engineering work (including documentation), and fabrication work. My biggest problem was getting out of builder mode and into flying mode (thanks to Vic S. for some good advice on that).

John Salak
RV-12 N896HS

[rvbuilder2002]

Originally Posted by KeithO

Then you will be issued an LSA compliant AW certificate.

Just for clarification, there is no such thing as an LSA compliant airworthiness certificate.
If a builder chooses to certify as an experimental amateur built, the airplane will get the exact same airworthiness certificate that any other RV model would get.

[KeithO]

Originally Posted by rvbuilder2002

Just for clarification, there is no such thing as an LSA compliant airworthiness certificate.
If a builder chooses to certify as an experimental amateur built, the airplane will get the exact same error than a certificate that any other RV model would get.

Th LS-1 from Arion Lightning is available only as an SLSA. Attached a copy of the registration info. Note that in the airworthiness classification it says "Light Sport".

The second attachment is for a classic model. It says Experimental amateur built. Pretty much 100% NOT in the light sport category. But the only way one can prove this is to review the weight and balance and performance data, i]like one would on any of the "regular category" airplanes which had weight and performance characteristics (from the time of manufacture) that complied with the rule.