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Workshop floor not level

What would you do in my circumstances?

  • Take the time to level the existing sloping floor before building the work benches

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    43
  • Poll closed .

Mistfarer

Member
Hi everyone,

The floor of the workshop where I plan to build my RV8 is not level, and I find myself with a tough choice. For context, it is a small place in my back garden, the fuselage and wings are unlikely to fit in there. I plan to use the place to prepare/prime small parts before assembly. The building is completely empty, I have yet to put together the workbenches and tools.

Anyone has experience working in these conditions? What would you do?

Thanks!
 
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For most of a build "level" probably doesn't much matter until you go to do things like rigging the wings and tail, and you can achieve that with shimming and jacking. If all you're doing is small prts and assemblies, I would think "flat" and "rigid" would be far more important than "level" when it comes to workbenches and such.

Edit: of course, a level workbench is a benefit in that stuff is less likely to go rolling off the edge on its own...
 
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I literally ordered some adjusting “feet” for my workbenches moments ago. I have a bit of the same issue with my floor in that they put in a bit of an aggressive slope near the garage door to egress water. I was not happy but concert is semi permanent.

I’m installing adjustable feet under my workbenches to get them to sit planar. I don’t care about level as I do solid and both benches in one plane.
 
The workshop floor where I started my build was not level either but the legs on the workbench were adjustable so it wasn't really a problem, and the jig for the tail surfaces was levelled independent of the floor. I think it is more important that the work space be dry, well lit, and not too cold. Of course you will need to plan for a bigger work space for the wings and fuselage!
 
If it’s a small space it’s very handy to be able to move the bench.

I have a very wonky concrete floor - my bench has little wind out feet to level it and some of these - to move the bench around when need be (pretty much every kit the bench has been in a different spot). I lift the corner using the wheels, adjust the feet and drop it back down. I think flat is more important than level btw.

https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/w935
 
Well, here goes a unanimous answer! Thanks everyone for your input, I'll focus on building a nice workbench with adjustable-length legs and wheels!
 
I don't think I've ever seen a concrete floor thats 100% level. Wooden ones in garden sheds are even worse.

Rather than messing around with adjustable feet on every bench, I just keep a package of wooden shims around. They are wedge shaped like a door stop it's super easy to kick one under whatever table leg happens to find a low spot. They are also handy for leveling saw horses or whatever when you get to the fuselage construction.

The kind of shims I'm talking about are the ones that come from the hardware store and are used in home construction for window and door frames.

They're readily available, at least in the states for a couple of bucks.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Nelson-Woo...-in-x-7-75-in-12-Pack-Fir-Wood-Shims/50051789
 
My workshop has a wooden plank floor. It's "level" but uneven.

I simply used wooden shims under my work tables to make them level and stable. No problems at all.
 
Observation from my build

If you build the wing assembly stand straight then the wing will reference to the stand. The flatness of the floor is unimportant.

When you build the fuselage, having a slow slung table to support the fuselage helps, and with the prepunched kit, almost everything will be self aligned. At some point, having a flat table is unimportant because the fuselage has a fore-aft curve, and left-right curve so having a flat floor unimportant. At the canoe stage, my fuselage sat on a thick bed foam on top of the table. At this stage, some builders mounted their fuselage on the rotisserie and this made the flat floor unnecessary
 
Been in construction for 43 years and "level" and " flat" are relative terms. And concrete floors are not really either. We used to build concrete floor houses........
I've always had to explain the difference to my customers.
God makes a body of water FLAT and level on a calm, cloudy, no wind day, But you can't build an airplane on it.
So build your benches flat and level it relative to what you are building.
Shims, screwed legs, what ever, The floor can slope 1" per foot and you can still build an airplane.
Get two glass tubes and connect them to each end of a clear rubber hose, fill with water and WaaLaa you have a spirit level. The flattest measuring device ever. Just like God made it.
Look up Spirit level on the wonderful web.
Art
 
Level

Garages have sloped floors. At least every home I've ever lived in has been sloped. I assume it's for drainage. I never gave it a second thought. Guess my airplane will have a heavy wing!:D
Actually, level doesnt come into play till later. Flat bench tops, for sure. Shims will level the bench if necessary. Never needed it. Straight matters. Jigs are easy to fab, align and level. I built jigs for control surfaces, tanks, leading edges and two jigs for wings. Everything else was plumb bobs and electronic level. My fuse is level now with two 1/4" chuncks of plywood under the starboard tire.
 
Told the builder of my shop / garage that I wanted a level floor, no slope. Same for the garage of the Last house I built. They were not used to that, but it was no big deal. Actually easier for the concrete crew, as the forms for the floor and wall footers are all laid out level.

As others have said, shim as needed!
 
A cheap laser level, with horizontal and vertical lines, comes in very handy when you need to check alignment of wings or fuselage.
 
A cheap laser level, with horizontal and vertical lines, comes in very handy when you need to check alignment of wings or fuselage.

Careful. I have a moderate-priced laser level, (Bosch) and it is off by 1/8" in 12 ft. That is within the advertised spec.

The only way to get things really level is to use a spirit level, as abwaldal said.

The one time when I think having a flat floor is important is when you lay out the position of the landing gear struts for drilling. A slight slope (typical of garages) is OK if you work with the fuselage aligned to the 'fall line' of the floor, i.e. pointed straight down hill. Then you use plumb-bobs to drop to reference lines on the floor.
 
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Let us have a talk about the standard “level” that you can purchase at any hardware store.

Do not assume that it is level, most of them are not. A quick test is to put your level on a flat surface and note position of the bubble. Now turn the level over in the exact same location and look at the bubble again. This is assuming that your level is the type that has a bubble on both sides.
Do the bubbles match? Chances are that they do not. Go to a large hardware store and be prepared to spend some time to find a level that is level.
Do not assume that more expensive levels are better then cheap levels.

Find, in the store, a new table saw, jointer or even a flat piece of particle board.
Now, place level on surface and note location of ball, flip it over and check that the other bubble is in exactly the same location. Chances are that you are going to have to check a lot of levels to get one that is that same.
Do the same for the vertical bubble on the level. They are rarely correct.
It can take a long time to get a level that is consistent. When you finally get one label it left, right, up and down.
When you get home from the store check using the spirit level that was mentioned in prior posts.
Do not trust a level that has been dropped.

The good news is that with the new prepunched kits they are usually straight and square. Not always but much better then previous kits. On my RV14 kit one aileron was straight the other had a twist that had to be worked out.
 
level doesn't really have any effect on building if you know what's going on. it's flat that counts.
stretch a small diameter line tight from one end to the other. i mean really tight. slip a dime under the line at each end of the table. now use another dime along the line to check flatness. my table top has a lot of shims between table top and supporting framing to make it flat.
 
the flat and level of it

OK if you want a "level" that you can hold in your hand. Get a 'Stabila' level
Built houses for 43 years and had lots of levels, lasers string lines, and spirit levels. Years ago I finally bit the bullet and bought Stabila levels.
Yes they only have bubble vial on the one side and on each end.
BUT the cheap Home Depot etc. ones with bubbles on both side that you flip to get the best picture are not good. I don't want the best picture. I want it RIGHT on.
When I finally spent the money on Stabila levels I think I threw away 13 or 14 levels with tape on this vial or that.
If you want a guaranteed for life accurate level get the Stabila
A plumb bob and spirit level is as flat/level as you can get. Oh ya maybe a good laser will work to. I've seen lasers off by as much as mentioned above.
Art
 
I have been trying to remember one time in my build that I cared if the floor was level or not and cant come up with one. No garage or shop floors are going to be level enough to meet the tolerances we need so why concern yourself with it.

There were many times I needed to make sure things were level but the parts needing to be level were not placed on the floor. Even weighing the plane, a perfect level floor would not help.

Im going t do my leg fairings this spring and maybe a level floor would help but Im in a hangar and just glad o have a floor!
 
for the record, .1 degree angle will open up .168'' over 8 feet. if the accuracy of the digital instrument is .1 degree.....you see where i am going with this. if you are off with a bubble at least you know it.
 
come to think of it maybe that's why the dig. level is so popular setting prop pitch. it's much easier to get to ''dead on'' than with a bubble in a protractor.
 
As many have said, "do not trust that your level is accurate". Test! (like Tom said in post 16).

I had a digital level that was off more than a tenth of a degree. I was able to open it up and adjust the dielectric tilt module, but I only use it for non-critical tasks. They are very handy when you need to set a non-level reference for things like checking control surface throws.

I have a Starrett machinist level that is used for anything critical (and it is checked just like all the others) The 8" is a handy size. I place it on top of a longer level (as a straight edge) for setting the wing incidence and such.

I mostly use the laser to line up plumb bobs and tasks needing a straight line over a long distance. Just easier than snapping a chalk line. Light doesn't bend much. They are not very accurate as levels. Check the specs. Use a water level for long distance leveling.

Know your tools and their limitations.
 
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