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Question: Tip-up Front Deck Riveting

snoopyflys

Well Known Member
Hi All,

I am trying to decide when to rivet the upper forward fuselage components. Can I leave it clecoed together while I fit the canopy and its associated parts or go ahead with riveting it in place? I have not done any avionics or wiring yet. But have completed installing the brake lines, fuel lines, and rudder pedal assembly. May be a builders choice, but I would like to hear some opinions on what others did at this point in the build.

Thanks,
 
Hi All,

I am trying to decide when to rivet the upper forward fuselage components. Can I leave it clecoed together while I fit the canopy and its associated parts or go ahead with riveting it in place? I have not done any avionics or wiring yet. But have completed installing the brake lines, fuel lines, and rudder pedal assembly. May be a builders choice, but I would like to hear some opinions on what others did at this point in the build.

Thanks,

One of the last things I did before flying. Just make sure you leave access to buck the rivets.
 
I know of a person that flew his plane for awhile with that forward skin clecoed on... Not that I recommend doing so:)

I waited on riveting my firewall in place until I absolutely had to. That sure made the fuel line and brake line plumbing easier.

Randall in Sedona
 
I use an all aluminum soft 3/32 pop rivet that aircraft spruce sells ,temporarily pop rivet panel in place (not every hole) then drill out rivets when canopy done ,install AN rivets after rest of construction done
 
While you could use soft Al pop rivets, there is no need to. Drilling out those rivets just invites inadvertently oversizing the holes. You can get by fine with clecos. Along the aft end of the skin you can cleco it in place from underneith the skin so only the tips are sticking out the top.
 
I know of a person that flew his plane for awhile with that forward skin clecoed on... Not that I recommend doing so:)
I waited on riveting my firewall in place until I absolutely had to. That sure made the fuel line and brake line plumbing easier.
Randall in Sedona

I would be interested in hearing about the inspector who signed off the airworthiness certificate on an airplane that was not finished.
I would like to advise people to avoid him/her.
 
Thanks and some clarifications

Thanks for the responses. Sorry, I should have been a little clearer in my original post. What I wanted to know is can I leave the Front Deck components (i.e., instrument panel (blank), sub-panel, forward fuselage channel, etc.) and forward top skin clecoed while completing the canopy? I don't plan on riveting the forward top skin until after most, if not all, of the cabin work is done. So, anyone have some words of wisdom they could share would be appreciated.

Thanks again.
 
Dan,
I suspect that if you don't make that structural area solid, you'll have more trouble than normal getting a good fit on the tip-up canopy. You'll discover that things seem to move around when fitting the forward canopy frame. When you adjust here, something seems to move there.

I do recommend riveting the instrument panel (or at least the panel blank), sub-panel, and fwd fuse channel into place before fitting/installing the canopy frame and canopy. However, wait as LONG as possible before installing the top fwd skin. That can become one of the last big rivet jobs on the airplane.
 
I have the instruments in, working on FWF wiring, and did not mount the canopy to it's frame until the forward skin is on. I fear more changes in dimensions with the canopy/fame fit until the front skin on on. Then I will screw, glass and trim the rear of the canopy. After being beat up by changes in the fit of the frame, I is now in my DNA to do it this way. I will let you know how this works out later.
 
Hey Dan,

Sounds like I'm just a little ahead of you. I'm not sure of the right way for this but here is my approach.

I drilled the sub-panel components but left them clecoed in place. My bird is already on its feet (7A), so I added brake fluid to the system and found a leak. Fixing was much easier since I just I clecoed the front structure. I also installed battery on firewall, battery and starter contactors, heater/bypass valve, cable clamps, pass-throughs for engine monitoring and electrical, throttle, mixture, ran wires to front of fuselage from tail, installed a wiring conduit system up the front of the firewall, made a mount point for my VP-X. After all of this, I then riveted the front structure in place, less the top skin.

With the front skin clecoed in place, I then fit and riveted my tip up canopy frame. I hear a lot of stories of guys installing and removing the canopy frame hundreds of times but the majority of my add/removes so far is with the forward top skin. I'm doing everything possible to minimize the number of times I'll need to crawl down there after its riveted on for good.
 
Fwd deck

Sorry no pictures, but after fighting canopy fitting issues that every time I clecoed the f-771 deck on, and then took it off, something was shifting.

I noted that the F-745 ribs the canopy hinges are on, are riveted on the firewall which is not very stiff, especially with the skin off. The only thing keeping the ribs from moving forward and aft are the rivets in the deck skin and the amount of give in the firewall.

I put a 2 inch triangular gusset attaching both F-745 ribs to the F-601L-1 firewall stiffener. You will need to have the skin clecoed on while final drilling your gusset attach holes to properly locate them.

These gussets lock the forward and aft rib position to the 3/4" angle stiffener rather than just the floppy firewall. I found this really stabilized the canopy attach ribs when I had the skin off.
 
Late to the party, but...

Maybe this will help someone else.

When I fit my tipup canopy, I cleco'd the top skin everywhere except where it meets the canopy leading edge. I found some small flat head (metric, IIRC) screws & nuts, & used those in the rivet holes to lock everything down while I fit the canopy. A bit of a pain to install, but I'm very glad I did it that way since the canopy fit seemed to be stable & now that I'm running wires, it's much easier without the lid on the forward fuselage.

Charlie
 
CLecos from the bottom side ...

Because I cut two access panels in the fwd top skin, I had ready access to the underside. I thus installed clecos from the bottom anywhere the opening/closing canopy would hit topside clecos. Worked great; everything held solid. No problems and my canopy fits as well as any I've seen. :)
 
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