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Pros and Cons?

gwav8or

Member
I'm thinking about buying an RV-6. I've owned certified aircraft but never owned an experimental. I know there are lots of pros but what are the cons of owning an RV? I know there's likely to be few but be honest, there has to be some cons right?
 
If you love the aircraft, there are no cons.
Aluminum is aluminum, an engine is an engine, the Vans design is exceptional, safe.
Plus,
if you desire, you can learn and perform aircraft maintenance under the watchful eye and guidance of an A&P license mechanic that will be a little bit less money.
And, you have 1,373,558 owners and a site that are eager to give you all the answers you will ever need.
All you have to do, as with any aircraft, is do your part.

R
 
Cons

I'm thinking about buying an RV-6. I've owned certified aircraft but never owned an experimental. I know there are lots of pros but what are the cons of owning an RV? I know there's likely to be few but be honest, there has to be some cons right?
Yes, there are cons, and you should be aware of them before buying. Here are some:

  • each RV aircraft can be different - different construction quality, different systems, different maintenance history
  • not all A&Ps are comfortable working on a homebuilt, even the most popular family of homebuilts, the Van's Aircraft RV
  • getting transition training is a bit more complex than with most other certified aircraft
  • insurance is slightly more complex - but I don't have any personal experience with this so I might have this wrong

Of course none of these cons are insurmountable, but always best to have as much information as possible before you make your choice.
 
Go to Oshkosh, opinion on parts

If possible go to Oshkosh later this month. There are multiple presentations about most if not all aspects of building, flying, and maintaining Experimentals. A trip to Wisconsin may be a minor expense compared to owning a plane.

As a purchaser of an RV in 2011, and flying it for 8 years, the one drawback that comes to mind is that parts ordered from Vans arrive as kit parts. These kits parts don?t just bolt on like purchasing a replacement item at an auto parts store. These parts may require skilled machining, special tools, etc. It is logical that Vans sells parts that need additional work before use. It is a kit business.

To me that is a downside. I?m sure there are many RV owners who enjoy getting in the shop and and completing the item and getting it installed. As the 3rd owner of my -6A flying the plane is my enjoyment, working on the plane is necessary but sometimes slow and difficult.

Purchasing a flying RV, at a very reasonable price, and immediately enjoying the freedom of owning and flying whenever and wherever I want has been fantastic. No regrets at all!!! I appreciate all the builders who keep increasing the supply of flying RVs, and build their skills to assist a non-mechanical pilot like me.

If you build or buy an A model, make sure the Nose Wheel bracket is installed correctly.

Carl
..
 
Two things I've learned

Since you asked about "cons," I'll skip the tons of reasons I like my RV-9A (which I bought used), and owning/flying experimental aircraft in general. I loved my old Piper Warrior, but I wouldn't go back. :)

Two insights:

1. Get to know the electrical system. This can vary quite a bit and even a well-built RV can be quirky in this regard. Troubleshooting becomes a game of Clue at times. As just one example, my builder installed a photocell contraption that he designed and built himself to control the dimming of the Garmin 430's key lights (!). I had to figure all that out when the gadget failed and the buttons went dark. Be sure to get a schematic if the builder has one.

2. Basically any A&P can pre-buy inspect a 172 or a Cherokee. You need an RV specialist to inspect an RV. Can't emphasize that enough.

I'm thinking about buying an RV-6. I've owned certified aircraft but never owned an experimental. I know there are lots of pros but what are the cons of owning an RV? I know there's likely to be few but be honest, there has to be some cons right?
 
I should have mentioned that

That's a really good point. When the hinge on my filtered air box gave way, for example, I couldn't just order a new one. Definitely slowed down the repair process quite a bit.

A similar sort of failure with my old Warrior would have been much faster to fix. Of course, the parts would have cost $17,328.....

As a purchaser of an RV in 2011, and flying it for 8 years, the one drawback that comes to mind is that parts ordered from Vans arrive as kit parts. These kits parts don?t just bolt on like purchasing a replacement item at an auto parts store. These parts may require skilled machining, special tools, etc. It is logical that Vans sells parts that need additional work before use. It is a kit business.

To me that is a downside. I?m sure there are many RV owners who enjoy getting in the shop and and completing the item and getting it installed. As the 3rd owner of my -6A flying the plane is my enjoyment, working on the plane is necessary but sometimes slow and difficult.
..
 
A few things come to mind:

1. The engine could have been built up from parts of questionable provenance. Make sure you look into this during your prebuy.

2. Insurance tends to be slightly higher because it is an Experimental.

3. Your face will hurt due to the extreme smiles it will give you.
 
The list

Pros:
Too many to list!

Cons:
Hmmmm..
Hmmm.

Oh wait..

Hmmm...

Uhhh...
 
Pros:
Too many to list!

Cons:
Hmmmm..
Hmmm.

Oh wait..

Hmmm...

Uhhh...

Yeh, really. Counterpoint.
All the cons mentioned could be applied to any aircraft. Most are actually excellent advise that should be adhered to.
I was thinking the ops thread was pondering more from a ?how safe? point of view.
There are some experimentals that do not satify my requirements.
Vans Aircraft and there are others do.
Hence, no cons.

R
 
Sometimes whether something is a pro or a con depends entirely on your own perspective and opinions.

For example, with experimentals there are no AD's ever. Most owners of experimentals see that as a strong pro. The FAA will never force you to ground your plane because of a potential design or manufacturing flaw nor force you to comply with an expensive fix for same.

OTOH that does not mean there can never be design or manufacturing flaws in your airplane. It just means that if design or manufacturing flaws happen to occur, whether or not you find out about them and whether or not an engineered and tested fix becomes available is entirely dependent on the kit manufacturer. And of course whether you actually implement that fix is completely up to you.

To be fair, I believe Vans is very good about issuing SB's and fixes when they feel its required for safety. Other manufacturers not so much. I don't this for sure but I would assume if you were looking at a used RV, Vans should be able to provide you with a list of every SB they've issued for that serial number aircraft. Figuring out whether or not they've been adequately complied with would be up to you.

Here's another potential con to owning an experimental depending on your perspective. They're experimental. Which is to say they are not certified aircraft nor are they required to be designed and tested to meet the same standards as certified aircraft. Again, it doesn't mean they don't meet or exceed the same standards, it just means they're not required to and you should go into ownership of one knowing that.

Another potential con to owning an experimental is again, they're experimental. Which means the builder is free to alter the design however they see fit. Often builder mods are fine and cause no impact to safety of flight. But not always. So its important to know what you're buying or have it looked at by someone you trust that knows.

Don't get me wrong, I don't know that I'd want to own a certified aircraft at this point. But I think its important to go into experimental ownership knowing that they are not the same as certified planes and the potential pitfalls are therefore different.
 
I don't this for sure but I would assume if you were looking at a used RV, Vans should be able to provide you with a list of every SB they've issued for that serial number aircraft. Figuring out whether or not they've been adequately complied with would be up to you.

A call to Van's isn't even required.
The info is available to anyone (whether they already own an RV or not) by going to the Safety and Service Info tab in the support section of the Van's Aircraft web site and then enter the aircraft model # .

(or click HERE)
 
One point not mentioned so far that isn?t a big deal for most, but could be to some, is that an EAB aircraft cannot be used for compensation or hire.
 
We recently purchased an RV6A and imported it into Canada, it?s areal pain in the butt and a major time consumer but that was then and this is now. We are really enjoying our experience with the RV.
I?ve owned a lot of aircraft over the years from Luscombe to Bonanza with everything else in between and I can honestly say that flying the RV has the most fun factor.
It?s in the same speed range as our Bonanza but it?s much cheaper to operate. OK to your original question, there are some RV?s that are built to a higher quality level than a certified aircraft and many I?m sure not as well built so as others have said you really have to do your homework and get it checked out by a very experienced and knowledgeable RV guy. Try to avoid the seemingly bargains as in my experience it?s a fools game. Buy the very best one you can afford. If you buy a really well built one there are very few cons, I?m in agreement with others comments. Remember just because it?s a certified aircraft does in no way guarantee you a trouble free aircraft, I?ve seen lots of junk certified aircraft still flying.
In my mind there is not a huge difference between a certified aircraft and a really well built experimental one. The one thing that stands out is the engine/prop...if they were majored by Joe Bob in his garage then it?s a **** shoot, maybe good, maybe not. Try to stick with an aircraft engine that was overhauled by a reputable station.
If you do get a nice one you certainly will not be disappointed, good luck.
 
Be as well informed as possible

I will second the advice about all similar model RV's are different. Different builders - different stuff. Especially, from what I have seen myself and heard about.

The earlier models (eg. the 6 or 6A) required that the builder do significantly more of the work preparing the parts for assembly compared to the current 12's and 14's as examples. From a few of Vic Syracuse's articles in KIT PLANES where he showed examples of what he found in some EAB airplanes of older vintage would encourage you to get a pre-buy done by someone EXTREMELY knowledgeable about RV's in general, and with the specific model you might be considering. I think that this way of thinking can also apply to any airplane being considered if you are 'airplane knowledge challenged'.
 
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Inspection by A&P

We bought an RV6 back in 2007... and still own it. I may never sell it. It is too much fun!

I may have missed a post that covered the annual condition inspection but it bears repeating:

You cannot inspect an EXP aircraft that you did not build unless you are an A&P so you will have to find an experimental-friendly A&P on or near your field.

Some A&Ps have a poor opinion of EXP aircraft and will not inspect or work on them, or have some VERY odd interpretations of the FARs as they pertain to EXP aircraft. EAA has lots of good reference material to help you once you do find an A&P to handle those inspections.
 
I would agree with the thought that a RV buyer who has no building experience AND doesn't like the notion of occasional fabrication and/or repair work might find the idea of owning an experimental (any kind) a bit challenging. You can't simply order replacement parts. Some repairs WILL require some fabrication. Not always easy to find an A&P who is comfortable doing this kind of work.

I absolutely enjoy my 9A (purchased 5 years ago), but also don't mind the occasional "wrenching & fab work" that is sometimes required.

Good luck and enjoy the experience!
 
You can't simply order replacement parts. Some repairs WILL require some fabrication. Not always easy to find an A&P who is comfortable doing this kind of work.

One thing to note is that you can hire/use anyone to work on your Experimental plane. Literally anyone. Someone who has built a similar plane, an owner of another RV, the guy down the street who works on fiberglass boats, an auto mechanic, or the teen who assisted in the build of an Eagle Nest RV in their high school. You can also fabricate your own airplane parts.

If you didn?t build your plane you only need an A&P to perform the yearly (conditional) inspection. On that day the A&P signs your log(s) to indicate, on that day, the airplane is OK.

A short flight from OK there are plenty of RV friendly resources in the DFW area.

Carl
..
 
If you didn?t build your plane you only need an A&P to perform the yearly (conditional) inspection.
Carl
..

Uh oh Carl, you're angered the grammer gods on the forum now, and you WILL be roasted til well-done and burned black... :cool:

-Marc
 
The value of the VAF braintrust alone in worth thousands in savings, potentially.
There are no situations or issues that have not been covered. Answers in a nanosecond.
I doubt such benefits exist in C-182 world.
It?s like having 1000 mechanics at your disposal, free of charge.
Screw the lawyers, go experimental.

R
 
Thanks everyone for the information. The Vans braintrust on this site is truly invaluable.

My main concern is/was not the general safety of Vans aircraft as I know they are generally as safe or more so than certified aircraft. My concern was things like having to fabricate parts and paying more in insurance. I enjoy building things and buying tools so those are probably not huge concerns.

The 6 that I?m considering was completed in 2018 buy an individual that claims to have finished 15 Vans aircraft. If I decide to move forward I will definitely take someone with me to inspect it.
 
Check the prior builds....

You could possibly save some time by contacting some of the owners of his/her previous builds and get their opinion of their planes build by him/her....

Maybe one of them is flying/living close to you now.....

Carl
..
 
I myself have not encountered any noticeable difference with insurance coverage on aircraft type. C-182 vs. RV-14 cost value per $1000 are very close.

R
 
One of the cons, depending on how you will use your aircraft, is that there is no anti-ice or de-ice equipment available. Not a negative unless you fly ifr in winter or high in the summer.
 
Hangar cost

IMO, the biggest "con" has not been mentioned yet, which is that if you get an RV you are most likely going to want to keep it in a hangar. This is a very significant expense, which cuts into all the other savings you achieve by acquiring an RV. There is a well-known poster on this forum who keeps his non-painted, polished aluminum RV outside, with a cover over the cabin area only I believe, apparently without a huge amount of obvious deterioration, so I suppose it can be done. But I think most owners of nicely painted and cared-for RVs keep them inside because they recognize keeping them outside will significantly degrade their aircraft's appearance and condition over time. In contrast, if you buy a production aircraft that, in many cases, has already been living outside for years, you are not going to suffer much incremental deterioration by continuing to leave it outside, and it costs a heck of a lot less than paying for a hangar. I'm happy with the RV I've owned for 20 years, but think prospective owners should be aware of and carefully consider this expense. I would be interested to hear the comments of people who have experience keeping them outside. Maybe there are some who disagree that RV's are generally made to live inside?
 
I think wanting a hangar is more of an aircraft ownership thing than an RV specific thing. Lots of 172's are kept in hangars. And the hangar costs the same no matter what plane you put inside it.
 
For me is unscrewing and screwing all the access panels during annual. The cockpit is small! The annual went well but man I was beat after seating what seemed like 1,000 screws, lol. My builder was great and got tons of complements from everyone who looked at the seven unzipped:)
 
Personally I believe a hangar and any plane go hand in hand, for me can't have one without the other, that's just me:)
 
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