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RV’s to OSH

Webb

Well Known Member
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Bonanzas, Cessnas, and Moonies have mass arrivals to OSH.

WHY NOT set up mass arrival to happen next year?
 
There was a MASS ARRIVAL of RV scheduled for this year at 9 AM on Sunday but the field was IFR and ATC would not assign another time slot so they had to arrive solo like everyone else.

When the FFI formation RVs are scheduled to fly during AirVenture, they have always had a mass arrival except for 2022 when it did not get rescheduled.
 
Maybe a unique "RV Arrival" profile.

Its pretty much an unplanned RV mass arrival all day Sat. Sun. Mon.

:p:p This is the comment of the year! LOL.:cool:

Funny comments, but seriously, mixing RV with cessna's and cubs could be improved. An RV corridor might help the landing phase would be the same. It would seem that consistent speeds and like performance under 130kts could improve the entry. Stacking a Cirrus behind a Cub then an RV is inviting conflict.

Regardless of the answer for RV's it still seems like there is opportunity for improvement rather than one long line.

BTW I had no issues getting in or out on Tuesday. Crossed Ripon at 7:04A and the pattern was full.
 
Listening in to Fisk control on Wednesday or Thursday morning, he was telling traffic if they could not maintain 90kts to side step the railroad tracks to the right and let “the train” pass. He would work you back in over Fisk.
 
WHY NOT set up mass arrival to happen next year?

Because it would be just one more special group gumming the works for the rest of us.

Besides, we're not that special, not in the context of performance. There are aircraft types with special needs, the mass arrival of yellow Cubs a few years ago for example. It made sense because it tightly grouped a large number of airplanes which typically fly very slow, rather than mixing them all through the arrival stream.

It makes sense to bring in the RV formation groups together, for several reasons. The special need is parking them all together, so they can get out together at show time. The practical aspect is they are a vetted group in terms of pilot skills. To be blunt, there is no way I'd consider tight spacing and formation landing within any random group of RV owners.

BTW, parking together in the North 40 is the foundation of B2OSH and the other groups. We already park together. It's called HBC.
 
I flew in a 9 ship arrival on the high 135kt arrival. Works great. We landed sunday around 5pm
 
The OSH arrival method. Mass arrivals....

mixing RV with cessna's and cubs could be improved.
An RV corridor might help the landing phase would be the same. It would seem that consistent speeds and like performance under 130kts could improve the entry. Stacking a Cirrus behind a Cub then an RV is inviting conflict.

Regardless of the answer for RV's it still seems like there is opportunity for improvement rather than one long line.

From a volunteer point-of-view, mass arrivals can be a PITA. This year there were 6 groups but, as stated the RV's didn't make their slot due to weather. The Cirrus group is odd in that their numbers are small and most come in for the mass arrival, then leave.:confused: The Bonanzas and Mooneys are well-organized and do well but there a lot of them and always go into the same area: North 40 but only as they come in: no reserved spots. Pipers this year were not bad as there weren't many of them. Cessnas always take forever as they are usually strung out in groups. Mass arrivals need both FAA and Air Boss approval and don't just "happen". The RV "mass arrival" was the formation group this year which is a well-organized group and relatively small in number. This was arranged this year due to the 50th anniversary of Vans. It may not happen again.

Sorting out different airplanes to fall into line would be impossible. It is a take what you get variety. A Cirrus behind a Cub would be a problem as they stall at such a higher speed and the Cirrus should probably be in the 135 elevation. If an RV is not comfortable behind a Cub or a Cessna, perhaps a little slow flight practice would be advisable. Van himself has said to do slow flight practice during EVERY flight. 90 mph in an RV should be a perfectly comfortable speed to fly. Would a notch of flaps help? Sure as that is below our flap speed. There will likely never be a type-specific corridor as, again, that would be impossible to organize and then fit in with everything else.

I have been in the Fisk Arrival in both the J-3 and SuzieQ at the 90 mph altitude and was more comfortable in the -4 due to visibility. The freaky thing is people sneaking into line from ANY where. Sometimes controllers will see them and make them go to the back of the line. It is getting more populated due to popularity of the event and this year all areas set records.

I have flown formation with a 65 horse J-3 Cub who was doing everything he could to get me to break. Didn't happen. Was I hyper-aware of what my airplane was telling me? Oh, yeah! But I also practice slow flight. In both airplanes. If your landings are starting to suck, slow flight practice can bring them back into line. That is from The Boss himself. RVs are probably one of the best airplanes to be "in line" as they have great visibility and great slow-flight performers.

Momex underwear in place......
 
I did notice a couple of mass arrival changes this year.

Landed 2 groups on 27. Straight in from east.
Piper & Cirrus ??

Bonanza and Cessna had 100-110 planes in each group.
Landed 36L & R


Congo line was all the way to Madison on regular notice.



Boomer
 
Mass Arrivals

I did notice a couple of mass arrival changes this year.

Landed 2 groups on 27. Straight in from east. Piper & Cirrus ??

Bonanza and Cessna had 100-110 planes in each group. Landed 36L & R

Congo line was all the way to Madison on regular notice.

The Cherokees were slated to be 50, Mooneys: 60; Bonanzas: 90. The Cessnas were only supposed to bring 90 but may have been as many as 125.

They don't like to bring in mass arrivals on 27 as it is over The Lake. Most mass arrivals will be on 36L/R for logistics on the ground. All came on Saturday except the Cirrus group which arrived on Sunday. They may have been on 27 as I missed their arrival. And the RVs, of course, scrapped due to weather.

The line to get to OSH was the longest I have seen it. For it to be strung out to South of Portage (nearly to Madison!!) was amazing to see! We were freaking out on the grounds! We came within 40 parking spots of closing the airport!! If the South 40 had not been expanded we may have had to close on Friday! As it was, we were able to handle all comers (No One Turned Away) with some VERY nifty arranging of airplanes! The Bonanzas (NOT a part of the mass arrival) were very tightly packed in an area we call Type Club. We had over 60 Bonanzas in that area alone!

It was a great year! Looking forward already to 2023! Bring your RV!
 
MPH or Knots

Well after my first time flying into OSH (Flew into Appleton and FDL before) now I know why some where not quite the 90-knot specified in the Notice. I was in the 90 knot Conga line @ 1,800 and had a flight of 3 Cessna's (Looked like 2 180's and a 172) overtake me from above the last one dropping down 100 - 200 ft in front of me. I was getting all kinds of traffic warnings and had my wife looking behind us for "something". The controller on the ground totally missed me and never called me to rock my wings as he was trying to sort at the flock descending from 2,300 at 135 knots. I am not sure how the last one saw me and maybe he was depending on me to sort him out. I ended up flying through and made a wide 180 to the left and looked for a gap to get back in line 15 miles back. I did talk to an EAA rep on the ground, and he told me there has been multiple discussions letting anyone who feels uncomfortable at 90 knots flying an optional 135. He basically told me if you can't fly a single engine aircraft at 90 knots you should not fly into OSH. I can see it's probably faster to fly the 135 knots and every RV out there can do this. What's to keep the 135 knot and 2,300 becoming the norm for GA single engine arrivals? Has there been any discussions or most likely opinions on this arrival? Made it back to Florida on Sunday. The RV is an amazing machine.
 
.... A Cirrus behind a Cub would be a problem as they stall at such a higher speed and the Cirrus should probably be in the 135 elevation. If an RV is not comfortable behind a Cub or a Cessna, perhaps a little slow flight practice would be advisable. Van himself has said to do slow flight practice during EVERY flight. 90 mph in an RV should be a perfectly comfortable speed to fly. Would a notch of flaps help? Sure as that is below our flap speed.
......

Be careful using 90 knots and 90 mph interchangeably. 90 mph equates to 78 knots. That could be part of the problem since the airspeed indicators on many older planes are only calibrated in mph.
 
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